Edge Leading vs Trailing Cleanup…
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I know Terry has a similar thread that I could have posted in, however I didn’t want to hijack his thread, so I’m posting this thread. I had been using edge leading strokes, heel to tip, for some time now, however I always had a problem once I switched to edge trailing strokes for films and strops. It seems bevel contact with the different strokes differs so much, that I had problems getting the same bevel contact once I switched from leading to trailing strokes. My solution was simply to use edge trailing strokes from start to finish and this seems to have solved the problems.
I know lots of you do use edge leading strokes for the diamond stones, so I’m curious as to whether you have the same issues or not? I think I do ultimately get more scratch-free bevels using edge leading strokes with the diamonds, however there is a lot more cleanup that has to be done with films and strops. Hope I’m stating this clearly enough.
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If it works for you it is not wrong. I don’t even bother going past 1000 anymore, my cheap kitchen knives cut what my wife cuts, much better stopping at 1000 than if I make them all nice and shiny with a fine toothless bevel. Is that wrong.. nope.. If you search you will find a lot of opinions on the subject and some science.. In the end, it if you are happy with the outcome that is all that counts.
It’s absolutely normal for you to notice a change in angle when switching from leading to trailing. With leading strokes, your grip spends very little of the stroke above the edge and as a result, you’ll see very consistent angles throughout the stroke. When you switch to trailing, a much larger part of your stroke has your grip above the edge. Even the tightest system ( tolerance wise) will show a jump in angle when the pressure point rises above the edge. The result shows that you’d have missed polishing the lower part of the bevel facets.
The answer lies in technique; trying to maintain the same pressure point, regardless of stroke direction and avoiding transitions across the edge. Once you have identified the cause of your frustration, make the correction and stick with it.
Unless the edge has a deep belly curve, you can probably get away with edge-leading strokes, (and/or scrubbing strokes) even with the film.
I’ll apologize in advance if I misunderstood the problem.
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Ya…you’re on about that. There is a slight rock due to play in the handles. For me, I seem to get the most consistency when I hold high on the handles, so when I apply pressure during the stroke, it’s always applied to the top of the handle. With a leading edge stroke from heel to tip, when I reach the tip, I’m at the top of the stone. When I get to the films and strops and use an edge trailing stroke from heel to tip, when I reach the tip, I’m at the bottom of the handles. There seems to be a difference in where on the bevel the stone makes contact, whether you’re at the top vs the bottom of the stone.
All that said, I guess it all comes down to doing what works best for me. I also want there to be a right way and a wrong way to do it, but I guess that’s just not the case. I’ll just keep working on it.
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I always hold the handles near the bottom – my thumbs placed at the second finger-groove. Mainly to keep from letting the pressure point to move above the edge, but also to keep my other fingers away from the edge. The only time I’ve ever cut myself while sharpening was the first time I did a really long jerky knife and let my pinky (little finger) dangle out in mid-air. Every time since has been when reaching beyond the knife’s tip. I’d get bit on the return motion.
If you grasp the handles at the top, you should take your angle measurements with pressure applied above the edge; preferably with the handle placed high on the edge. Since I use a low position, I measure with the stone at the bottom end of where a stroke would end and with pressure applied there.
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I have found this discussion to be very thought provoking. I have never considered where on the stones I have been placing my fingers.
So I went and picked up one of my diamond stones. I apparently put my index finger near the top of the stone, with my other three fingers and my thumb on the bottom half of the stone. This just seems like a natural way to hold the stone.
Wouldn’t it be best to hold the stone in a way that distributes pressure as equally as possible along the entire length of the stone?
On longer knives I find myself using the entire stone, so would more consistent pressure along the length of the stone provide more consistent results?
Rummels
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The other way to look at is…now that you know that finger hold position and pressure effects how the stone scratches the bevel. Study the resulting scratch patterns of these different finger positions with a magnified visual aid. Then use this knowledge to steer where you place your scratches. By understanding this cause and effect you can use it to your benefit. Then you are truly in control of your stone work. You can still be consistent just more capable.
To qualify this further… depending on what your doing this ability to place or direct the results of your effort is particularly helpful. When first profiling the bevel angle it helps you to specifically remove steel from right where you need to. Then to go on to flatten the entire bevel shoulder to apex. Then while polishing it helps you remove scratch remnants from where they remain.
Marc
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