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Angles not wide / large enough?

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  • #58129
    MarcH
    Moderator
    • Topics: 67
    • Replies: 2625

    First, on your microscope, I wanted to say: all the USB scopes I have ever used have both low and high-power magnification.  Now you’re turning the fine focus just a little either way to focus the image at the low power you are viewing with. Try to turn the fine focus knob past where it goes out of focus, then as far as it goes. Then it should allow you to fine focus again, down at the other end. Now on the high power.

    I learned how to sharpen with a WE120, my first setup. I think learning how to use the standard vise well along with all the ins and outs that you’re learning now, made me a better, more complete and knowledgeable W.E. user. If I had started with the WE130 style vise, I wouldn’t have learned and experienced half of what I know now.

    Here’s a W.E. Forum thread on correcting for the blade lean. There are links to other threads you will see while reading through this thread:

    Mounting FFG blades in a WE120 (Standard Vise) – Wicked Edge Precision Knife Sharpener (wickededgeusa.com)

    This W.E. Forum thread addresses another issue causing offset bevel angles from thick knives:

    https://knife.wickededgeusa.com/forums/topic/we-120-angle-difference-per-side/

    Here as a youtube video that addresses the blade lean issue and shows a method to measure the knife’s overall angle to compensate for the clamping lean:

     

    Marc
    (MarcH's Rack-Its)

    #58156
    Ribstabsheart
    Participant
    • Topics: 1
    • Replies: 10

    Spent a good amount of time getting familiar with my WE, and got the 1500/2200 grit stones yesterday. Still breaking them in (the one knife I used them on didn’t seem much different), so I’m withholding judgement on those for now 🙂 Overall, spending lots of time learning the different strokes, inspecting my work with a microscope, and being more deliberate with how I work the knife.

    Was curious how you guys would approach larger chips/broken edges like the pictured one? I’ve already been working this knife for a while, and I’m somewhat worried about wearing out my stones trying to smooth this one out. Is there a particular method you would recommend (different angle, particular stroke, working both sides simultaneously vs. one at a time)?

    Also, I was watching a couple videos on stropping, and WE recommends the strops be tacky/strick together if properly loaded, and spray with isopropyl before use. I tried that, but now the strops are particularly dry. I’m not sure if I properly loaded the 5 micron strops (the yellow paste seems to rub off quickly in some areas and show leather), so maybe that is part of it. I’m trying it dry from Marc’s suggestion (and it seems to work OK), but didnt see anyone else mention it around here.

    Thanks!

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    #58158
    tcmeyer
    Participant
    • Topics: 38
    • Replies: 2078

    Ribstabsheart:  To save time and excessive stone wear, I file the edge flat, down to the bottom of the deepest defect, using one of the finer diamond stones – like the 800 grit.  How long you need to work and edge is directly related to the amount of steel you have to remove and this process very quickly removes a lot of that steel.  Having done that, now there s no apex to worry about, so you can go to your lower/lowest grit stones to re-establish the apex.  I usually use my 200-grit stones until I see that I am very near the center of the flat area.  I then go to my 400-grit stones to recreate an apex and a burr.  I try to not get 200-grit scratches right at the apex, as they seem to take forever to remove.

    Note: If the defects are limited to a short section of the edge, try to limit the edge filing to that area, as we’re talking about a lot of stoning here.  Also, this process removes enough steel that you are effectively shortening the life of the blade.  Doing it more than a few times in the life of the blade can be significant.  If I think it’s happening regularly, I consider increasing the angle of the bevels to make the edge more resistant to breakage.

     

    #58159
    Ribstabsheart
    Participant
    • Topics: 1
    • Replies: 10

    Thank you! I think I’m just going to live with it for now (as its already a skinny paring knife), but filing down the edge makes a lot of sense considering how much I already worked at it and it has only slightly “shrunk”. Wondering if maybe a cheaper handheld file might be a better option (opposed to working down my 800 grit)? If I keep running across these battered blades, I may have to invest in the 50/80 grit stones.

    I’ve been sharpening most of my knives to 20° per side, so maybe I could work those up to 21 or 22 with my next sharpening session?

    #58160
    tcmeyer
    Participant
    • Topics: 38
    • Replies: 2078

    It only takes a very few strokes with an 800-grit stone to flatten an edge.  I think using a regular file is a bad idea.

    #58161
    MarcH
    Moderator
    • Topics: 67
    • Replies: 2625

    I’m guessing tcmeyer is not assessing Ribstabsheart’s edge damage as being significant which is why Tom’s recommending the 800 grit method and thinks the file is a “bad idea”. Possibly, tcmeyer thinks the edge damage can be removed easily and the original profile recued.

    I have used a hand-held metal file horizontally/longitudinally across a damaged knife edge and removed the damage edge with good success. That I followed with a total edge reprofiling.

    When you’re needing to remove a lot of edge damage here’s a discussion on reprofiling, essentially the same process, from an earlier W.E. forum post. Read the full thread.  In that earlier forum post using a file was discussed. tcmeyer even made a custom W.E. paddle setup with “first-cut” files.

    Bevel Angle Change Question… – Wicked Edge Precision Knife Sharpener (wickededgeusa.com)

     

    Marc
    (MarcH's Rack-Its)

    #58162
    Ribstabsheart
    Participant
    • Topics: 1
    • Replies: 10

    It only takes a very few strokes with an 800-grit stone to flatten an edge. I think using a regular file is a bad idea.

    Thank you for the clarification. I have to remember that while it looks catastrophic under the microscope, I can barely see it with my naked eye. Maybe I’ll try a couple swipes just to see how the edge changes under the microscope to better understand.

    I’m guessing tcmeyer is not assessing Ribstabsheart’s edge damage as being significant which is why Tom’s recommending the 800 grit method and thinks the file is a “bad idea”. Possibly, tcmeyer thinks the edge damage can be removed easily and the original profile recued. I have used a hand-held metal file horizontally/longitudinally across a damaged knife edge and removed the damage edge with good success. That I followed with a total edge reprofiling. When you’re needing to remove a lot of edge damage here’s a discussion on reprofiling, essentially the same process, from an earlier W.E. forum post. Read the full thread. In that earlier forum post using a file was discussed. tcmeyer even made a custom W.E. paddle setup with “first-cut” files. Bevel Angle Change Question… – Wicked Edge Precision Knife Sharpener (wickededgeusa.com)

    Thank you, Marc! I will read this post and take some notes. The file would probably be pretty handy if I ever get handed a blade that was used as a pry bar. I’m afraid to look at my first Spyderco under the scope, because I used it in some very dumb ways a decade ago, haha.

    #58163
    MarcH
    Moderator
    • Topics: 67
    • Replies: 2625

    I would say if the amount of effort you’re expending seems excessive to remove the edge damage with the 100 grit as you’re first getting started after matching the bevel angles with the marker technique…then 800 grit may not be where I’d start… it all depends on the steel’s hardness and the extent of the damage you’re looking to remove. For microchips to the apex for a softer steel 800 grit may be perfect.

    Marc
    (MarcH's Rack-Its)

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