Pro pack II set screws

[Xbander]

Clay,

When your suppler retools the L-brackets to #10-32 will they continue to drill and tap both sides?
Thanks to Curtis for pointing this out, having it on both sides does add options and a value. I would
add a couple extra screws to my kit, like insurance, hope you do not need it, but; having them as a option want hurt. Insured advantage in both the angle bar and the micro arm adjustments.

This may not work, considered a drop of heat glue on the tip of the micro arm screw. It would stick on the
screw tip and provide a soft tip to bind into the micro arm adjustment threads.

[Martin Singer]

The parts should never have had the black screws. They were designed with the pointed #10-32 screws to match the detents on the degree bar. The machine shop took a liberty with substituting the screws to save cost, not realizing the significance of their function. We’re working rapidly to get it resolved. It will involve sending out correct, replacement L-Brackets along with return labels so we can get the incorrect ones back. We should have a timeline within a few days. We’re waiting for the full list of people needing the parts to come in.

Clay, Please add my name to the list of recipients of black undersized screws. I am impressed at how quickly you react to issues. Very happy with the WEPS. Marty

[wickededge]

I’m pleased to say this again: Sometimes you ask tough questions or point out things that could use improving and for that I’m grateful! You are helping Wicked Edge by being real and genuine, qualities that I really admire. Thanks to guys like you and Scott Sherman, and Phillip Pasteur and many others, I’m hearing honest and sincere perspectives that are helping me to stay even more in touch. I love the Wicked Edge community and especially the forum because its populated with such quality people. Please don’t ever be discouraged from voicing your thoughts!

-Clay

[Fred Hermann]

+1 Karma fpr Billibong. Let the haters hate.:woohoo:
Last night I tried a few things which seem to be working and don’t damage the kit.
I use the setscrews on the smooth side of the base bar, but I put 2 layers of scotch tape on it, the screw still grabs, and has yet to slip horizontally. When it gets chewed up, I scrape/peel it off, use a little goo gone, alcohol wipe, and reapply.

This is a TERRIBLE idea for the set screws on the arms. A ball of sticky melting tape goo works, but its a bear to clean out. So I came up with a better idea. Put a couple little pieces of a toothpick in the hole. The wood mashes, doesn’t gum up the threads, and protects both screws as far as I can tell.

I love the riser, I love the new arms, the setscrew issue I would never have noticed, but would have suggested some sort of improvement. So as is… out of the box I give this a 90%. Once the set screws have been solved, it will be at 100%.

I really love this kit, and the family on the forum. It’s a rare bunch that doesn’t go ballistic over every little thing, it’s an even rarer (sp?) bunch that actively makes suggestions on improvements.

Anyhow, I’m babbling.

Let me know if the tape and toothpick thing works for you, or you’re doing something different.

[Steven Corpstein]

+1 Karma fpr Billibong. Let the haters hate.:woohoo:
Last night I tried a few things which seem to be working and don’t damage the kit.
I use the setscrews on the smooth side of the base bar, but I put 2 layers of scotch tape on it, the screw still grabs, and has yet to slip horizontally. When it gets chewed up, I scrape/peel it off, use a little goo gone, alcohol wipe, and reapply.

This is a TERRIBLE idea for the set screws on the arms. A ball of sticky melting tape goo works, but its a bear to clean out. So I came up with a better idea. Put a couple little pieces of a toothpick in the hole. The wood mashes, doesn’t gum up the threads, and protects both screws as far as I can tell.

I love the riser, I love the new arms, the setscrew issue I would never have noticed, but would have suggested some sort of improvement. So as is… out of the box I give this a 90%. Once the set screws have been solved, it will be at 100%.

I really love this kit, and the family on the forum. It’s a rare bunch that doesn’t go ballistic over every little thing, it’s an even rarer (sp?) bunch that actively makes suggestions on improvements.

Anyhow, I’m babbling.

Let me know if the tape and toothpick thing works for you, or you’re doing something different.

In my past life building better mouse traps, I’ve used a small piece of lead (e.g. split shot) when I didn’t want to mar up a surface with a set screw. It holds really well and is easily removed when no longer wanted or needed.

[wickededge]

Clay,

When your suppler retools the L-brackets to #10-32 will they continue to drill and tap both sides?
Thanks to Curtis for pointing this out, having it on both sides does add options and a value. I would
add a couple extra screws to my kit, like insurance, hope you do not need it, but; having them as a option want hurt. Insured advantage in both the angle bar and the micro arm adjustments.

This may not work, considered a drop of heat glue on the tip of the micro arm screw. It would stick on the
screw tip and provide a soft tip to bind into the micro arm adjustment threads.

Hey James, we will continue to drill and tap both sides.

-Clay

[Phil Pasteur]

This makes great sense, as you don’t need to makes pairs of the “L” brackets for one each left and right.
Fewer part numbers, and left/right agnostic parts to make it easier for folks to figure out how to assemble the machine.

😉

Phil

[wickededge]

This makes great sense, as you don’t need to makes pairs of the “L” brackets for one each left and right.
Fewer part numbers, and left/right agnostic parts to make it easier for folks to figure out how to assemble the machine.

😉

Phil

Correct on all counts! 🙂

-Clay

[craftyhack]

So I lose another karma vote for asking hard questions?
Take them all if it means I can post with honesty!

First +1 Karma’ed you Billabong, your posts here were what made clear to me the issue and the implications(and the way for me to confirm whether or not I was affected), very helpful indeed, thank you :).

Got the recall email today, and I am affected as well. No biggie for me, I just recently got my PPII and due to unexpected circumstances haven’t even been able to set it up and won’t for a little while. Rather than shelving it :(, I have been working on having a certain well known (and embroiled in controversy) online reviewer with whom’s crew I have become fairly well “e-acquainted” to accept shipment of my set to use and review, or alternatively to stop telling the audience what the best constant angle sharpener is on the planet without having tried them all… and especially to stop making references to THIS one without having ever tried it so as not to inappropriately dissuade potential purchasers from considering the WE :/. I have made progress to a “maybe”, and THAT took some work :). That could just be to satiate me(shut me up), but I hope not! It is a battle of wills I think…

Anyway, it is nice to get the recall notice so quickly (vs. a normal company’s really long time after getting sued recalls for much more important things(no offense :)), like your children’s furniture/toys that can harm/kill them :/). Once again WE shows model company/CS behavior… thanks Clay! Glad I got this recall before I shipped to the reviewer, I would have felt pretty stupid ;).

[Phil Pasteur]

Just curious Chris, why do you care so much about Karma points.
I have been around here for a couple of years or so and never heard this kind of discussion. I did not have any clue what the Karma thing was nor was interested enough to figure it out until you started commenting on losing points…??

If you are saying what you want to say, communicating exacty the way that you want to, not being censured by admins… Why do you care?

My interpretation of the Karma system is that when you say somehing that is productive and that people like, they bump up the Karma. If they don’t like it or agree with it, the cut a point. That is the way it is supposed ot work. Nothing about nastiness, nothing about confrontation, just indicating agreement or disagreement. Again, why do you care? Don’t you think, as you feel that you should be able to express anything that you want, others are being nasty if they drop you by a point, therefor expressing themselves. Is it a one way street here? Is it required that you take retribution by threatening to reduce someone else’ Karma because you think that they might be the person(s) that dinged you. Really??

Sorry, I just don’t get it.

Anyway, your numbers are at an all time high. Maybe we can get back to talking sharpening now and return to the congenialty that has been the rule around here for years.

Is that straighfoward enough for you?

Phil

So I lose another karma vote for asking hard questions?
Take them all if it means I can post with honesty!

Do people want to encourage members to be nasty or something?
Perhaps I should be posting on Blade forums etc. about these issues?
Where everyone will give their own ideas on what is going on.

Thanks

edit – Send me a private message and tell me what you think about my posts rather than hide behind a button.
Do I now hand out bad karma in return, to whoever I think it was? 😉

I can understand people thinking they are protecting Clay here, but do you think he needs your help?
If you can’t accept constructive criticism, then it’s a sad place here.
Like I said, I can post somewhere else where the discussion can go any direction?

[Mark76]

Hey Chris,

I wanted to raise your Karma by ten points. Five for nearly being fellow countrymen and five for your comments.

I’ve lived in Adelaide a number of years ago. And if it wasn’t for a girl, I’d still be drinking wine in Barossa Valley, spend my weekends in the outback, enjoy the upcoming summer and wonder why roo meat, which is the best meat I’ve ever tasted, is so cheap.

There was absolutely nothing wrong with your comments. On the contrary. One of the reasons I like this forum so much is that it is an place where people discuss all things related to the WEPS and to sharpening in general at a high level. I think everyone here learns. And the only way in which that is possible is when people are open and utter their ideas frankly. And when others listen (and perhaps have a different opinion and react again). Fortunately that is exactly what happens here. And that is why I like this place so much. So please don’t feel inhibited in any way to say what you think. I think the reactions by Mike, Curtis and others also support you (and others) in this.

I said I wanted to raise your Karma. But somehow, I get the impression it’s not about Karma points ;-). Nevertheless, if you need a Karma boost, let me know.

Molecule Polishing: my blog about sharpening with the Wicked Edge

[craftyhack]

Just curious Chris, why do you care so much about Karma points.

I am very new here, but a long time inet, forum, and before that BBS user (back when you got someones BBS phone number and dialed directly into it with your creaming 14.4k modem or less :D). I will let him state why it is important to him, but I can tell you my perspective. There is nothing wrong with stating opinions or even healthy debate. But it is frustrating to me when someone uses a forum’s “buttons” to vote down what I have stated without saying why(could care less about the points themselves, vs. what they represent). If for no other reason than what they are thinking may be right on and I and everyone else could benefit from what made them push that button… if only they would take the time to post their thoughts. If they are choosing NOT to do so, then voting down someone elses opinion (where the OP DID devote some of their time and effort to help others) just isn’t cool IMO. It isn’t the end of the world, it is the internet, happens all of the time, I have learned to let it go, although I probably would have posted something similar, just to ask whomever to why what I said was wrong, all contributions are welcome!

The idea of forums like this (and the beauty of the internet, the most important knowledge innovation in centuries IMO) is to work together to create a collective of knowledge and evolve that knowledge via discussion, healthy debate, etc. for all to benefit from. To disagree by clicking a button, but to not contribute with the counterpoints that led to the disagreement to me doesn’t help anyone and is just lazy(either contribute or don’t, but button criticism without any discussion is lame), and is discouraging to those who DO spend the time to post their opinion, experiences, whatever. Again, this is just my opinion based on my own experiences and thoughts, but over time I have learned to ignore the minority who choose to criticize without explanation (on this board the VAST minority, which is refreshing :)) . IF nothing else, consider it good manners.

IMO, there is little difference than say being out to dinner with a bunch of people, be in a healthy discussion, and have someone at the table reply with “your wrong”, and leave it at that, vs. giving their point of view in a more constructive fashion. To me, that would be pretty rude(and I have never seen it, even after everyone has had too much to drink :)), but etiquette and netiquette in practice have diverged A LOT since I first was on the net (i.e. people do on the internet what they would never do in person I am willing to bet my house on), mostly likely due to the anonymity that most choose for their internet presence/persona. That is one of the reasons I chose a while ago to use my real name, etc. in most forums, etc., it keeps me honest :).

P.S. looking forward to my Karma going down after this post… because I am ineffect insulting “someone(s?)” here. I am not meaning disrespect, rather, hoping to motivate whoever to join in the fun!

[Phil Pasteur]

There was absolutely nothing wrong with your comments. On the contrary. One of the reasons I like this forum so much is that it is an place where people discuss all things related to the WEPS and to sharpening in general at a high level.

Me too. I just couldn’t see where getting upset over something like Karma points fit that mold!

I think the reactions by Mike, Curtis and others also support you (and others) in this.

I think Curtis told Chris not to worry about it. In any case, even if everyone save one agrees, that one shouldn’t be labeled as nasty because they disagree… and hit someone on Karma!

But somehow, I get the impression it’s not about Karma points ;-).

How did you get that impression Mark?
My impression was just a bit different. Of course that was just because each time Chris lost a Karma point… he made a point to comment on it, sometimes at length, most recently in a somwhat threatening manner. Sure seems like a preoccupation to me.

You know, I am sitting here and writing this and asking myself why… why do I ge sucked in to this kind of discussion at all. It has no bearing on what we are all here for, it really doesn’t. Come on..KARMA points…

Still I feel compelled, at the risk of losing Karma points (oh NO!) to reply in an effort to “get it”.

I would be really pissed if somebody was taking money from my bank account, but what can I buy with stupid Karma points??? What do I lose if somebody …or a bunch of somebodies, take them all away??

Michael. You said you had gotten over worrying about Karma points, then justified the reaction. (BTW, I had a 300 baud Folksmodem that I used to dial into BBS operated by my buddies, to discuss Physics problems, I would have nearly killed for 14.4) Confused here! The point I made is that the whole inconsequential Karma thing was probably put into some forums to let the general populace, among those the ones that do not want a confrontation, to give a reading on what is going on. For those that just feel one way or another and don’t think it is worth a major text based arguement. Why not just take note of that going forward and either make adjustments or ignore the input. Why get upset with someone for using the tools that are there without subjecting themselves to a long drawn out debate that will likely never change the poster’s mind? They say discretion is the better part of valor… and I say, why beat your head against a wall for no gain. Just use the buttons and leave unscathed. I am sure that is what they were designed for (somebody must have thought people would simply take the hint instead of getting all upset).

I am done with this now. I just felt compelled to ask the question because the whole thing is so foriegn to my way of thinking and the way this forum has worked since I have been involved.

…it is an place where people discuss all things related to the WEPS and to sharpening in general at a high level…

Maybe someone can expalin how Karma points is related to the above??

I would much rather try to figure out something productive…like whether we burnish while stropping, or the best angle and finish for an M390 Gyoto (just got a new knife in that steel :woohoo: ).

Phil

[craftyhack]

Michael. You said you had gotten over worrying about Karma points, then justified the reaction. I would much rather try to figure out something productive…like whether we burnish while stropping, or the best angle and finish for an M390 Gyoto (just got a new knife in that steel :woohoo: ).
Phil

Hey, I just got my first ever M390 too, 581 BM Barrage, love it, sadly it will sit in its box in my safe until I get some other things taken care of, but looking forward to seeing what its got when the time comes, and then of course what the WE can do to it! Congrats on your Gyoto, totally different knife I know, but the learning about the steel is fun, and boy do you have alot to play with! From what I have read of M390, it should be a fantastic knife!!! I have found through a friend on BF a maker who uses s125vn, I plan on requesting something in 125 just because, talk about a super steel :). He even has a nice chef’s knife in Elmax @ 63-64 RC, first I have seen of that! He is mostly an M390 guy (want to get a couple more of those too), but apparently loves to experiment with new steels more than most makers, i.e. even if not in his “comfort zone”: http://ferrumforge.com/kitchenknifegallery.html

Yep, you are right, I did say that I have learned to ignore button ratings on all of the forums that I frequent when I get dinged and have no idea why, and I move on to say why I understand Chris’s feelings, basically both are are true :). I don’t care about the ratings, or the people who leave them if they don’t contribute (maybe they just had a bad day or mis-interpreted something, thinking positive doesn’t hurt either), I assume if I post something WRONG that other contributors will correct me, so really no harm done. Just because I understand how Chris feels doesn’t mean I let those things bother me anymore, unless *I* have had a bad day, which I have learned to recognize when I start typing a rant… then I usually go do something to relieve my stress (a nice Irish whiskey or scotch neat and an opus x usually does the trick ;)), and come back and I am all better to proceed as if nothing happened. Basically, if I let inet posters to get to me (some of my other forums have hundreds of thousands of users, including a fair share of trolls), I would be a psychopath by now…

[Chris]

Greatly appreciate all the kind comments from everyone.

I will try to keep my posting on topic. 😉
So no need to go over everything said here, except to say this is a great community, with truly great people ready to help.

I have been using my WEPS non stop since the new arms arrived and can say I am in love!
I would send a pic of my smile, but it’s too wide to fit here.

Looking forward to posting some more interesting stuff when I get time.
Not having issues with the screws, as I have simply shortened up the micro adjust and leave it for now. (not using it)
I reversed the cross bar and use the angle guage, I’m happy with that.

The SuperEraser works well on the 1200/1600’s, they eat the rubber pretty fast though.

Trying to resist the temptation to pull the arms ball apart for a look.
The micro-adjust stud must be in two pieces, would allow easier fitting of a rubber boot.

Also if ever I damage the stud thread, it could be the smaller replacement part?
Something tells me there might be a better locking idea for the micro adjust stud.
Not convinced a screw locking against a thread is ideal.

Is the stud made by your workshop Clay, or is it part of the original ball joint and they put the socket head in the end?

edit-

Of course that was just because each time Chris lost a Karma point… he made a point to comment on it, sometimes at length, most recently in a somwhat threatening manner. Sure seems like a preoccupation to me.

Phil

I hope you are not the one that has a preoccupation Phil?
A very unkind statement from you, but I guess you just don’t understand?

Hope you can move on like I am.

[Author]

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