? counterfeit 12 inch guide rods . . . .
- This topic has 25 replies, 8 voices, and was last updated 07/03/2019 at 6:01 am by
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They look like the set I bought from WE a couple weeks ago. Do the handles fit correctly? If so, install them and use them. They do not come with nuts as nuts are not used with the current gen ball joints and the thread does not need to be as long as there are no lock nuts to consume space.
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Expedia
The packaging that your guide rods came in looks identical to the packaging that my 12” guide rods came in. My 12” guide rods came directly from WEPS.
The length of the threading on both my original 10” guide rods and my 12” guide rods is 3/8”.
If I run a finger nail up and down the sides of any of my guide rods it creates what I can best describe as a high-pitched squeaking sound. I hear the same sound if I put one of my unused 100/200 grit diamond stones on one of the rods and quickly move it up and down the rod.
I hope this helps
rummels
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My last pair of rods from WE make a whistling sound when I slide the handles up and down on them. It’s nothing to be concerned about and will not wear your handles out.
I make my own rods with a die turned over the end of a 0.257″ rod, as opposed to 0.250″ diameter. As such, the die is a very tight fit and difficult to turn. Since it’s so hard to turn, I only put on about 4 threads. With only 4 threads, the die hasn’t had time to properly align itself with the rod and this means that the rod is likely not perfectly coaxial with the ball (Heim) joint threads. In turn, this means that if the rod turns in the ball joint threads, it could change the angle significantly. So I need to use the jam nut. This only leave about two threads to engage the threads in the ball joint. Since there is almost zero load on this connection, it’s OK.
The correct way is to turn the diameter down on a lathe before threading. This will leave a very small, but visible step in the diameter where the threads meet the unthreaded portion. My Gen 3 Pro has this step on its rods.
To make the rod it is machined, leaving tool marks. If you polish the tool marks off the rod will then be under sized. The rods I bought last week have tool marks on them and they make the expected sound when the stone is move over it quickly. You got OEM Rods and saved on the shipping, it’s a win!
Best advice is to buy from WE, even if you pay a little more, shipping is quite expensive these days.
We get used to amazon and forget that they own the world.. I ordered a pair of Jeans from Wrangler directly and paid $8 shipping .. they didn’t fit.. I had to pay $12 to ship them back.. that’s $20 to try on a pair of jeans.. This is our world as we know it..
Thanks Airscapes. WE might have switched manufacturers of these rods. They should be polished. I’ll discuss it with Kyle to see whats up. If they still have polished ones in stock Ill buy them when I re-new my 100 stones which will pit me over $100 for free shipping and re-sell these.
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To make the rod it is machined, leaving tool marks. If you polish the tool marks off the rod will then be under sized. The rods I bought last week have tool marks on them and they make the expected sound when the stone is move over it quickly.
They look like the set I bought from WE a couple weeks ago. Do the handles fit correctly? If so, install them and use them. They do not come with nuts as nuts are not used with the current gen ball joints and the thread does not need to be as long as there are no lock nuts to consume space.
airscapes, thanks for trying to dispel this confusion and help the forum out. You are correct. The questionable guide rods have the three telltale characteristics of real genuine guide rods ordered and machined to W.E. specifications:
- shortened threads – W.E. shortened the threads in the most recently designed rods while they shortened the threaded ball rod end pockets they thread into, to allow for a longer usable guide rod and to improve the efficient use of the stone’s full length while moving across the knife edge.
- W.E. deleted the lock nut because it was determined there was no need to have it and it limited the usable guide rod length and the stone’s full travel.
- The newest version guide rods were machined with a slightly wider diameter to improve the fit and tolerance in the newest version paddle bore holes. These new rods have a rippled appearance and a distinctive singing or whispy sound as the plastic paddles slide up and down across the high and low spots. These singing rods are the “tell-tale” characteristic that lets me know it’s the real thing and the most precisely performing guide rods offered.
Your efforts are recognized and appreciated. Thank you!
Marc
(MarcH's Rack-Its)Thanks Marc. Thats why I asked my questions as these as you say they are not counterfeit they are of a “new style” rods that are different from my other two “polished” sets. I’m still not a fan of them singing. And “singing” is a good term you used to describe their noise. The closest I could come was sliding up and down on an acoustic guitar string. And when I finished my edge with them the right rod was tight the left rod had loosened which I attributed to possibly shorter threads if they were not OEM and I did not want to over-tighten and strip the ball joint threads.
I opened a ticket maybe they will note why the singing rod innovation. I have a die set and I’ve read here that several members have fashioned their own rods from stainless stock.
I’d like to hear Clay’s opinion on why the new singing rod design? I have not seen Clay posting since the blade show? Maybe he takes a vacation after the Blade show event?
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My WE is several years old. The stones are mounted on plastic. If the current stones are plastic and the new rods “rippled” to the point of vibrating when the stones are used wouldn’t this create wear on the holes in the stones, resulting in a loose fit over time?
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My WE is several years old. The stones are mounted on plastic. If the current stones are plastic and the new rods “rippled” to the point of vibrating when the stones are used wouldn’t this create wear on the holes in the stones, resulting in a loose fit over time?
No, there won’t be any appreciable wear between the plastic and the steel. Where you have a relatively polished hard material (steel in this case) against a soft (plastic) material, the interface is in slip mode, as opposed to traction. This is why lightly loaded gears are often designed with steel against nylon or steel against brass. You might get deformation of the softer material, but that would require a substantial force between them, simply not there is this application.
By the way, I am pleased to see that WE has shortened the rod threads and the length of the female threaded end of the ball joints. I suggested it in April of 2014. At the time, I said that you only needed about three turns of the thread to hold the rod, as there is no side or axial loads of any significance. I recently found one of my home-made rods was threaded at an angle, so the rod angle would change if it rotated in the ball joint. I added a jam nut to lock it in position and it works just fine with only two threads of engagement.
I rather enjoy the whistle. Oooeep! Oooeep! It’s music, and nothing to worry about.
tcmeyer. But aren’t steel shafts smooth? I have not seen the new rods. They are described as rippled. One might describe a round file as rippled. It would be interesting to post a photo, made with your microscope, of the ripples to see if they are smooth or sharp
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