Using a ceramic rod for touch ups?

[Expidia]

Just watched an interesting vid on Youtube of this sharpening guy who uses a WE system and recommends using a ceramic rod for touch ups between sharpenings.

I wondered this myself after my son asked me if it was OK to use his steel on the kitchen knives thatI already sharpened for him on my WE.  I was under the impression (or I read somewhere) don’t steel a knife that has been sharpened by the WE.

Is there a difference between using a steel vs a ceramic?  Myself and my kids all have steels that came with our knife sets years ago, but I’d be happy to buy a ceramic rod for each of us if a ceramic is the better way to go?

What say you?

Seems this site won’t allow this direct link so just search Youtube for: Touching up a knife that has been sharpened on the wicked edge.

 

 

[Marc H]

Jende sells ceramice rods, separately and this set.  

Here’s Tom’s Youtube on them:  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FutZJATpFWo

Marc
(MarcH's Rack-Its)

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Expidia

[Expidia]

I tried to cut and paste that Youtube address, but it wold not allow me to paste.  How did you do it?  Do you have moderator priviliges to do that?

And Thanks for the link to the steel.  It probably isn’t that pricey since its for two (I didn’t check their shipping fee).  But Amazon also has many models on their site.  Since I have to buy 3 of them is there a trade off price wise on the quality of a ceramic rod.  At first glance, they all look like just white rods to me.  Is there such a thing as some are better than others when it comes to the quality of ceramics rods which is denoting a higher cost?

Thx

[Expidia]

Actually, this article I found just answered all my questions.  Great article showing how a sharp edge can flop to one side and a steel or ceramic can put it upright again.  This has been an ongoing question of mine.  It describes the differences in the various choices in honing steels and ceramics.

Also read the comments from users at the end of his article.  Some good info here too!

https://www.seriouseats.com/2016/09/how-to-choose-knife-honing-steel.html

[Expidia]

I ordered the Jende set (good vid).  They sell them on Amazon too for $75 with free shipping.  $69 directly from Jende but another $14 or so for shipping.

This brings the cost of each to $37.50 which is inline with the higher end other unknown brands on Amazon.  But since sharpening is Jende’s business I’d rather own their brand of ceramics.

I wish I’d known about steeling before as with my other thread that I started saying my edges were rolling.  Now I know it was simply the super sharp thin edge of the blade flopping to one side and a few light steeling strokes (using a ceramic) can put the edge upright again before cutting chores.

[Marc H]

I believe using a ceramic rod is a quick easy remedy for a rolled knife edge to allowed continued use until it can be sharpened; a band-aid.

Some ceramics are quite aggressive. Improper use or use at the wrong angle will in essence apply a micro bevel and as Tom Blodgett stated in the Jende Industries video it can remove a lot of steel resulting in a thicker edge.

Marc
(MarcH's Rack-Its)

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Expidia

[Marc H]

I was reminded by a Forum contributor about this article from “Science of Sharp”, What does Steeling Do

discusses the use of Steels and Ceramics in great detail with micro-photographs and concludes that edge steel is removed and a microbevel is formed.

 

Marc
(MarcH's Rack-Its)

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Expidia

[Expidia]

Ya thats why I got the Jende double set as one is not as aggressive as the other.

[Readheads]

Yes. Feel, sound, swarf marks. Just use minimal (3-5) light strokes with sticky thumbnail scrapes or you will start a belly. Messermeister is great at $25.

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Expidia

[Marc H]

If your going to use a ceramic steeling rod, which will ultimately remove some edge steel and micro-bevel your Wicked Edge profiled knives.  Then at least do it in a predictable and consistent manner.  Using a Spyderco Triangle Sharpmaker ceramic rods or a Lansky’s Turn-Box ceramic rods would certainly allow this.  The Spyderco model even allows for different angle selection options.  Then when you do re-sharpen on the Wicked Edge your bevels won’t be all over the place resulting in even more steel removal.

Marc
(MarcH's Rack-Its)

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Haffner, Expidia

[Expidia]

Red heads, Wow, quite a collection you have going there.. clearly you have been bitten by our knife collecting hobby :0)

and thx for the heads up on the pototential belly.  I’ve already “mastered” the art of creating a recurve on several of my knives already :o(

[Expidia]

Thanks Marc.  I’ll take what yiu say under consideration.  Makes sense but Im only going for a few light swipes to stand an edge up.  If I see Im throwing the bevel off I’l have to look into the Spyderco ceramic triangle rods.  Couldn’t hurt to keep them in my quiver.

[Marc H]

Expidia wrote:

I’m only going for a few light swipes to stand an edge up. If I see I’m throwing the bevel off I’ll have to look into the Spyderco ceramic triangle rods.

I’d thought, if you’d read “The Science of Sharp Article” you would have changed your understanding of the results of using the Ceramic Steel Rod.  Realizing it removed steel and imparted a microbevel and did not, in reality, stand up a rolled edge, you want to use the best ceramic rod method for your Wicked Edge sharpened knife edges.  Waiting to “see if you’re throwing the bevel off” may be too late and difficult when your adding a microbevel!

 

Marc
(MarcH's Rack-Its)

[Expidia]

Good article.  He certainly gets deep into the subject from a scientific view.  Great pics too.

It goes without saying that a steel removes metal.  This is why I thought the ceramic style would remove less metal.  That Jende ceramic set has as the 2nd tool produced in the black ceramic which supposedly (from the Jende vid) removes less metal than the white and that’s why I bought that particular set.  I’m just trying to get a slight rolling edge upright again and if using a ceramic lightly cause a micro bevel thats fine with me as I’m just looking for a smoother cutting blade.  I started out early on with the WE mirroring my kitchen knives and then adding a micro bevel.  But I did not like the added drag even though it was a better cutter I prefer better slicing.  Its not like I’m not removing more metal each time I freshen a rolled edge on the WE.  I have to continually wash the grey metal grit off my fingers and the blade edge with a paper towel between stones, so I don’t contaminate the next stone progression.  So metal is coming off one way or another.

I might be able to take some before and after pics with my digital microscope depending on if my max magnification is high enough to show the edge like the author of that article pics does.

I think I caused a run on Amazon’s Jende ceramic stock as when my office mate tried to buy the same set I ordered last night they are now out of stock and don’t know when more are coming in.  Or I snagged the last set.  He ordered off Jende for $5 more.

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Marc H

[Expidia]

MarcH, I don’t think its an actual rolled edge I’m alluding to.  It feels more like a slight burr always on one side and steeling does remove or stand it up with only a few swipes on a steel.  I’m not concerned with adding another bevel (yet).  I’m thinking this is because the two sets of kitchen knives I own are German and Japanese and neither is of the VG10 grade of steel.  I don’t ever have this issue with my more expensive folders probably because they are of harder steels that retain a super edge longer.  And I don’t cut much with them as they are all more for show.  My hardest chore with those is slicing open an envelope.  For cardboard boxes like from Amazon I use a single edge razor blade.

And you were right about using Goo Gone for those times I do get the adhesive residule on my blades.  That stuffs a dream at removing adhesive.  Thx

• This reply was modified 5 years, 8 months ago by Expidia.

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Marc H

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