Difficult blade grinds – mounting in vise

[Josh]

If you guys have videos/pics, post em here on how you mount difficult blades. I think it would be great to consolidate all of our ideas into one thread. I will update videos as we go. Here is my most recent one.

[Gib Curry]

Great idea.

Dread isn’t quite the right word.

But, the set up is so darned important it still, almost always, feels like a hurdle to me, a challenge.

The first two, larger Shuns mounted fine but I’ve got paring knife in the vice now that I have zero confidence that it’s mounted correctly so I’ll go back and try it again until I am.

And that’s a pretty straight forward FFG blade.

So, to have an “encyclopedia” of challenging mounts will be priceless and invaluable.

~~~~
For Now,

Gib

Φ

"Everyday edge for the bevel headed"

"Things work out best for those who make the best out of the way things work out."

[Marc H]

This topic is another look at a previous post: Topic #18521 Why are my blades tilted in the clamp? This is still an issue for me being a beginner with the WE. The more I use it, the better I get and the more I look critically at my results. Then the more I strive for correctness in my technique.

I have been able to measure the cant left on FFG Kitchen knives with the angle cube to determine the blade centerline, do the math and adjust my left and right sharpening angles accordingly to make my bevel even, on the tilted knife with good results. But several of my knives are very narrow from the spine to bevel and impossible to measure the cant with the angle cube with so little of the blade protruding above the clamp. How do you handle these?

Also someone suggested using something as a shim to clamp between the vise and the blade to cant the blade back to center so it clamps vertically. What sort of things have you found to use as shims? Most everything I use has allowed the blade to slip. Its a lot of trial and error.

Marc

Marc
(MarcH's Rack-Its)

[Josh]

Can you post some pics up and I’ll try to get a pic or video next time I do a similar blade?

– Josh

[tcmeyer]

I’ve thought about cutting some small shims at the FFG angle so I could clamp the blade instantly to its vertical axis. Unfortunately, the only material I have on hand that I could cut accurately is UHMW, which is super slippery. I wonder if you could cast something using a liquid like epoxy.

[Mark76]

If you guys have videos/pics, post em here on how you mount difficult blades. I think it would be great to consolidate all of our ideas into one thread. I will update videos as we go. Here is my most recent one.

I think this is a great idea! If anyone has videos about this topic (or if you happen to encounter one on YouTube), please let us know!

[Edit: I just created a thread dedicated to videos. If you have any videos you like, please post them here: http://www.wickededgeusa.com/forum/getting-started/13191-the-video-thread ]

Molecule Polishing: my blog about sharpening with the Wicked Edge

[Geocyclist]

I could use some serious help with Benchmade 940’s. This knife has very little flat space to clamp to. The blade is so long, that I want to clamp it further back to get less angle in the belly. (improve sweet spot) but I run out of flat space to clamp to. I have had decent results working with full flat ground knives. The 940 is worse than a FFG. If you aren’t on a flat then the rest of the spine is a inverse bevel and there is nothing solid to clamp too in the top position. If you drop it down to the bottom you get the spine, but not enough clearance for low angles.

Hey Clay,
What I really need is something like the low angle adapter that is offset. It would clamp in like the low angle adapter, but be offset, to allow the knife to be mounted further back.

A wide adapter would also be nice, a low angle adapter, but not so tall, with vice jaws that are 2 inches wide. I would use this for any knife 6″ or longer. This might help with the flex on thin but long kitchen knifes.

[Josh]

I have done one before but can’t remember how I did it… if you wanna meet up sometime this week let me know and we can go over it…

[Zamfir]

Ok, I have a question. Just trying to understand the idea and theories. So I have my first fixed blade. It is a zero tolerance 0180. The blade is a tank and a weird but kinda sexy grind and shape.

I would not think it was done on purpose but there is the full width of the blade at about 0.2″ and there are sections of it left that thick along the spine of the blade but also regions where it is thinned out. The entire, not sure of the correct term, main thinning angle is not equal on both sides. I can mount it very square in the vice because of the flat parts. But the edge, is off to the left a bit since the angles are different on the main thinning angle. Are they just messing with me? having the angles different makes no sense..

It thins up and then there is around a 22ish deg bevel on each side as the edge grind. So, the blade sits in the vice square but offset as shown in the picture.

I know it really does not matter playing with a deg or so, but the question is, if Hinderer designed it this way, would a person want to make the bevel sides equal as compared to main thinning angle or to the main spine (zero line) of the knife? The part you are measuring with the angle cube and the stone resting on the apex is off a little to the left. I am going to thin this from 22 per side down to 17 per side. It just looks like I am going to be removing a lot of material..kinda scared to be honest. Not sure how freggin long this will take. Supposidly this Vandas 4 EXTRA mystery metal is supposed to be a hardness of 62..I hope it does not chip on me. BUT.. that is why I wanted to try different steels and buy the Wicked Edge..Never had a knife over 200 bucks before..Damn I ramble when it gets late.. :S

Attachments:

• ztbevel.jpg

[tcmeyer]

It’s lonely here at 3:00 AM, but if I want interesting conversation I have to wait for the wife to go to bed so I can talk to myself.

A one-degree difference in the primary bevels is pretty typical from what I’ve seen. Judging from your drawing, the difference in primary bevel angle would only move the edge 0.010-0.015″ off center and make little or no difference in secondary bevel width. I’d suggest you go with the Sharpie method to match the factory bevels.

[Zamfir]

So you are saying not to thin it down to 17 degree and leave it at 22ish?

Another weird thing is I think the blade gets thicker as a whole on the last 1/3 of the blade tworda the tip. I simplycan not find any position in my vice and get a good result from the Sharpie trick. I went in and out and angled and tries the tape dmark trick. Nothing would result in a decent Sharpie pattern. That drove me nuts. Not sure what I am going to do with this just yet.

[tcmeyer]

Finding that the shoulder behind the edge is thicker near the tip is something I’ve seen quite a bit too. I think it indicates a hand-ground primary bevel. The fellow doing the grinding tends to lean into it against the sanding belt as he grinds the blade near the heel. Then, as he sweeps toward the tip, he’s being overly careful as that’s where he can do the most damage. He’s looking for a visually pleasing sweep rather than uniform thickness. It’s just a natural thing that he’d leave a little more thickness at the belly and tip. It’s also why you often see blades with a deep curve near the heel.

Going to a shallower angle will increase the bevel width where the blade is thickest. Staying with the 22 (I almost always use 20 dps) will help to keep that bevel width more uniform, if that’s what you’re worried about.

Josh does a lot of regrinding on blades to correct for thick shoulders. Maybe he can offer some advise.

[Author]

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