Contemplating a Gen 3 upgrade: some questions

[phillyjudge]

I have been reading as much as I can here and looking at the You Tube videos, but have a couple basic questions…

What is the 5/8″ “rule” I  keep seeing? Is that part of the instructions? Is it only for the middle of the blade?

Are there issues about the tightness of the clamp for either FFG or squared off spines?

What is the reason people are taping the G3 jaws?

What tape are you folks using?

Are you guys still using Josh’s “dropped tip” technique for the sweet spot? (The one where he marks a parallel line across tape on the stone?)

Currently I am using the PP2 and do not enjoy measuring and calculating the angle splitting for FFG or canted blades…

[Anonymous]

I am only offering some content. I have a few questions for you. How long have you owned your PPII ? ON a side note, I am also from the Philly suburbs. Are you using a sharpie to define your existing bevel? When you talk about calculating angles, I think you are over thinking this process. Are you not successful in your attempts to sharpen your knives? This process is fairly straight forward with a lot of wiggle room for blade angle. The Gen III jaws allow for a wider blade. people use tape to add pressure and also to protect the blade from vice scratches. The Gen III vice is wider than the GenII which can be a problem for some knives. Welcome to the forum.
Bill aka ET

[tcmeyer]

The 5/8″ rule isn’t a rule – it’s just a nominal height over the jaws at which the degree graduations are approximately accurate.  Where users have wondered why they measure different angles than those shown on the bar, it’s probably related to the height of the blade they have clamped.

[Anonymous]

If you can imagine, setting the angle at 20* degrees then raise the knife up higher , this will change the actual angle. the higher you go, the smaller the angle. That why the angle cube is so important. it gives you the true angle, no matter if the knife sits 1/2 inch in the vice, or 5/8ths.. also the height of the blade, ( example ) a pocket knife with a 1/2 inch high blade , ( not 1/2 in thick )…. Compared to a chef’s knife that is 2 inches high. if you set the arms at 15 degrees, the actual angle will be way different with the 1/2 high blade, compared to the 2 inch high blade…Again the angle cube is the final word in actual angle.

[phillyjudge]

Thanks guys.

Been here awhile—don’t post much.

I do use the Sharpie method.

I always use an angle cube, but that in itself isn’t enough if the center line of the blade is tilted; hence, Josh’s (and others’) subtract and split the difference method.

Still curious if the G3 clamping issues are resolved.

Bill, pm’d you.

[Anonymous]

Got your email and replied. when you calculate a tilted blade, the angle cube is even more important. Trying to get the blade perfectly vertical 90* to the base, helps making the angle on both sides easier to create. there are some nice tips I have discovered in my research, protecting the arm joins can be accomplished using a single paper washer that slides down over each arm to protect the joint. a circular paper washer with a 1 in O.D.. and an I.D. to match the arm diameter.
Also holding the stones on the top will ( in the same place each time ) will insure any radial load on the joint will be repeated each stroke.

[tcmeyer]

If you place an AngleCube on one of the diamond plate stones, you’ll find that the angle will change as you slide the stone up and move the grip point above the edge.  There is some clearance designed into the blocks to allow for contaminants and such, so that the stones continue to move freely on the rods.  This also allows the stones to rotate slightly on the rods.  When hand pressure is applied below the edge. the “slop” will tend to lower the angle.  When you move the pressure point above the edge, the stone will rock over (pivot about) the edge and increase the angle.  If you pay attention to the noise, you can actually hear a “click” when the stone switches from one line to another.  I’ve measure differences between 0.45 and 1.05 degrees.  Try it yourself.

This all drove me to convert all my stones to bronze bushings.  I understand that Cliff Curry has a much easier fix.

The simple solution is to hold the stones at the bottom finger groove and try not to let your grip point go above the edge.

I’ve got some photos of this but couldn’t understand the new dialog box when I tried to insert them.   I should have been paying closer attention when it was discussed.  But then I have a terminal case of ADD and have never paid much attention to anything I wasn’t really interested in.  Aaargh!

 

 

[Anonymous]

Here are some useful tips…

[Josh]

phillyjudge wrote:

I have been reading as much as I can here and looking at the You Tube videos, but have a couple basic questions… What is the 5/8″ “rule” I keep seeing? Is that part of the instructions? Is it only for the middle of the blade? Are there issues about the tightness of the clamp for either FFG or squared off spines? What is the reason people are taping the G3 jaws? What tape are you folks using? Are you guys still using Josh’s “dropped tip” technique for the sweet spot? (The one where he marks a parallel line across tape on the stone?) Currently I am using the PP2 and do not enjoy measuring and calculating the angle splitting for FFG or canted blades…

Hey man hope I can add some points to the very helpful info the other guys have posted above.

– I have not had any issues w/ tightness of the clamp, but sometimes I do need to throw a piece of tape on the spine for added friction so the blade doesn’t slip (I pretty much always do this anyway so as to prevent any scratching from the vise). I can pick up the entire wicked edge and granite base by holding the knife handle, but I can rotate the knife in the clamp by pushing up and down if I try.

– Some have put tape over the gap on the side of the vise to prevent abrasives from falling down onto the cam shaft… I haven’t messed w/ it so far.

– I use the drop tip method only when I regrind a knife because I know that I set up the grind for an edge that is a true angle from heel to tip (or as close as possible). On pretty much all production knives I tilt the tip down because most all of them actually widen up at the tip and this will allow you to match the existing, yet changing, angle. I use a sharpie with almost every knife =)

Other note: I have found a consistent blade cant/tilt of the knife to the right whereas on the gen 2 vise it was always to the left. It is only about 1 degree so not a big deal, but other than that I haven’t had any issues. I am also using aftermarket steel jaw inserts if that changes anything.

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