Honing oil on Diamond Lapping film?

[uilleann]

On the KME it was recommended that I use honing oil on the lapping film (tape).  I think it was for making the film last longer…. maybe for keeping the film from loading up on metal to fast,  maybe for ease of cleaning between use.   But WE, I think recommends, using them dry.  So what is the deal and which is best and why?

[tcmeyer]

I’ve never used honing oil on any of my WE media.  Maybe it might extend the life of the film?  I never considered it because of the mess it makes.  About a year ago I bought a bottle of honing fluid, which isn’t at all like oil.  I wonder if that would work better and with less mess?

[Lenny]

I have a KME as well as a WE and I like using a very, very thin film of a light weight mineral oil on my KME films. The amount should be so small that whatever gets removed from the film in the course of sharpening will stick to the blade and only the blade. I would use a small dropper bottle and simply touch the nipple of the dropper to the film 1 or 2 times to get this amount of oil. There really shouldn’t be a mess made. One film (1×4 inches) would last me around 7 or so knives, and would of course be responsible for both sides of the blade.

[Marc H]

Welcome to the Wicked Edge Forum Lenny…if you’re asking if it’s OK to use the oil,  all I can say is have at it…that choice is your’s.  I have not heard of anyone trying oil on the lapping films.  If it works for you and gives you the results you’re looking that’s all that counts.  Those of us on the Forum will be the first to tell you if based on our knowledge and experience, it’s a mistake or will cause you a problem.  I’ve never heard anyone using oil so I can’t say why you shouldn’t.  Maybe someone will weigh in with a reason why not to.  But as of now I say see if it works for you and meets your expectations of what results you’re looking for.  The only thing I can think of is the oil may be a physical barrier to prevent the fine grit lapping films from making contact to the steel.  The films are non porous and won’t absorb the oil.  The oil may just lay there and prevent the physical contact you need for the abrasive to work.  After-all the the lapping films are very fine grits.  Give it a try.  You may have a new trend or technique.  All that really matters is what you like to use.

Marc
(MarcH's Rack-Its)

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wickededge

[Lenny]

Hi Marc. This is something I will try but will be something that will take some time in determining benefits or detriments. So far, I have only used my WE films dry.

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Marc H

[Marc H]

Oil’s used with very fine grit Arkansas Stones.  It may just work well with the diamond lapping film??  You won’t know till you try.   As long as the oil doesn’t deteriorate the films psa and cause it to lift off the platens.

 

 

 

 

Marc
(MarcH's Rack-Its)

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Lenny

[Lenny]

Yes, that has been my experience with the KME lapping film. The oil helps to keep the fine metal dust from filling the “pores” of the film. I also generally feel that some lubrication while working with abrasives is a good thing for the stone or hone, this is anecdotal though.

Yes the, deteriorating the glue is also one of my fears when adding an oil. I might have to take a small piece of a strip attach it to glass and submerge the whole thing in oil for a few days.

[tcmeyer]

I’ll add my two cent downer here.  I think that any honing oil or fluid would work on plated diamond, but probably wouldn’t do much more than make a mess.  I think when you get down to the polishing films (perhaps 6 micron?) and finer, you’ll experience a bit of hydroplaning, where the oil film resists being displaced by the pressure of the steel being worked, kind of like the journals on your car’s crankshaft are held apart from the main bearings by the film of oil pumped between them.  That’s how sleeve bearings work.  The result – if my guess is any good – is that it’ll just take longer to achieve the same amount of polishing or metal removal.

We use oil to keep the pores on our sharpening stones from getting plugged up with metal swarf.  The surface of diamond film doesn’t have pores.  While the surface can get quite dirty with the accumulation of microscopic bits of steel, my experience with diamond film is that it cleans quite easily, and that the film will need replacement because of surface damage (the most common cause) or because the diamond particles on the film eventually become dull, thereby reducing its effectiveness.  I’ve never had a strip that I had to change because it was plugged up or otherwise overloaded with sharpening schmutz.

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Organic, Marc H, Lenny

[Lenny]

You have a good point about the hydroplaning bit, the oil film width would be very important their. While my coarse grits (=>1 micron) cut fine this may be why my 0.1 micron lapping films seemed to cut unexpectedly slowly: the film thickness of the oil was greater than that the abrasives. Doing a quick google search I was able to find oils that had film thicknesses down to 0.1 microns but nothing lower.

I would like to know more about how it may affect the useful life of the films though.

[Rick]

I don’t use any fluids on films.

but what I do that helps a lot is after a second use I use 90% alcohol on a sponge swab to clean the film. it makes a difference. it unloads the build up.

BUT – keep it on the film, don’t soak it.problem is it looks like it melts the plastic paddle. it got shiny.

the first time I was “generous” with the 90%. now I only wet the swab, keeping it off the plastic and on the film only.

I think the only thing that “may” have happened is ungluing the glass.

I’ve considered a lube on stones but don’t want them coming off the paddle so I haven’t yet.

[Lenny]

I contacted WE and was informed that they source their films from 3M. I contacted 3M and asked about lubrication and the response more or less use what you like.

Today I touched up the bevels on my Sebenza. When using the lapping films I applied a very, very small amount of a light weight oil to the film. I don’t have an exact amount but to put it into perspective it was not enough to cover the entirety of the film by rubbing it around with my finger and the amount that came off on the blade was not enough to bead and run down.

I have used the films dry before and I could not tell a difference in the polish or the speed, these are of course anecdotal. I found no evidence that using oil results in a better end result. However, there was one difference that I did like. While using the films dry I would often find that the films would “stick” to the bevel along certain areas of a film. This would make me want to change the pressure/speed I was using. With the oil it felt much more consistent. What seems to be agreed upon is using less pressure is better for the edge and the useful film lifespan so this is something I’m going to use for my next round of sharpenings to see if I can find any other benefits or detriments.

• This reply was modified 5 years, 12 months ago by Lenny.

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Mr. Toad, Organic, Marc H

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