Ceramic Stone Wear?

Legacy Forum Archive basic-techniques-and-sharpening-strategies
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Hey all,

I’ve read many places that the ceramic stones do not wear. The first couple knives I sharpened, I found white specks of ceramic being shaved off the 1200/1600 stones like crazy. It would happen mostly when I drew the stone into the edge, so I stopped doing that and only drew away from the edge, however it seems both of the stones are still shedding.

When I got the ceramics, they were both completely flat–when I held them together, there were no gaps for light to come through. Now, there are concave gaps in the stones. Using the angle cube, there is a slight difference in degrees when the edge is in the middle of the stone or on the edge, where the stone is “thicker.”

I figured this was just the stones being broken in, but I thought I’d get some opinions for assurance as I thought these weren’t supposed to wear.

Thanks for your input! I can try and get pictures later if my post is confusing.
jw

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The 1200/1600 (at least mine) are softer and do wear. The micro fine are much harder and don’t (within my ability to tell :wink: )

I pretty much only use the microfines at this point.

Ken

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[quote quote=“KenBuzbee” post=10728]I pretty much only use the microfines at this point.
Ken[/quote]

I’ve read the same statement from you in some other thread as well, and I just have to ask how you manage that? I currently have the PP2 so my biggest “jump” is from 1000 grid diamonds to the micro fine 1.4 um stone, and that is actually giving me quite a bit of trouble, I have to scrub away a LOT to get rid of the 1000 grid diamond scratch marks with the 1.4 um ceramic stone.

The diamond progression from 100 to 1000 is great and almost effortless but then going to the ceramics is difficult, so I’m thinking of getting the 1200/1600 as an intermediate step, but it seems that might not really do it?

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At one time, there were reports of a “kiln layer” that would flake off, but did not affect the ceramic. It was just some “stuff” left over from making the stone and they were going to add another step to get rid of the left over fluff on the stone.

If I am remembering correctly

5

[quote quote=“johpe” post=10751]

I’ve read the same statement from you in some other thread as well, and I just have to ask how you manage that? I currently have the PP2 so my biggest “jump” is from 1000 grid diamonds to the micro fine 1.4 um stone, and that is actually giving me quite a bit of trouble, I have to scrub away a LOT to get rid of the 1000 grid diamond scratch marks with the 1.4 um ceramic stone.

The diamond progression from 100 to 1000 is great and almost effortless but then going to the ceramics is difficult, so I’m thinking of getting the 1200/1600 as an intermediate step, but it seems that might not really do it?[/quote]

There are two things I’ve seen.

My coarse micro fine are (IMO) more coars than my 1200s

My 1000s are well broken in and don’t leave scratches nearly as deep as they used to.

While in theory the jump Fromm 1000 to 1.4μ seems large, I don’t find it actually working out that way.

Beyond that, some basic (sorry if TOO basic) thoughts.

In the early stages (say 100-400) it’s easy to leave deeper scratches and fail to remove them all before the 800-1000s. I’ve done this many times and had to return to 400-600 and rework from there forward. It’s very easy to miss these until you are well into the ceramics. Steels vary, but generally how many strokes are you doing at each grit?

Are you following your edge at every stage with a good loupe? This is the most helpful diagnostic tool I own. It lets me see exactly what is going on, both on the bevel and at the edge.

How’s your pressure? I start with only the weight of the stones and lighten it as I go. By the last few dozen passes of any stone, it’s just a gentle kiss.

I hope any of this helps?

Ken

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[quote quote=“KenBuzbee” post=10753]My coarse micro fine are (IMO) more coars than my 1200s
[/quote]
I’ve seen this from many different people in different posts, which make me really think twice about buying them since between coarse MicroFine and fine MicroFine I have no problem removing scratches. It’s between 1000 diamond and MicroFine that I think the step is too large (for me at least), I would love to have 1200-1600 and maybe 2000-2500 diamond plates Clay! :wink:

[quote quote=“KenBuzbee” post=10753]In the early stages (say 100-400) it’s easy to leave deeper scratches and fail to remove them all before the 800-1000s. I’ve done this many times and had to return to 400-600 and rework from there forward. It’s very easy to miss these until you are well into the ceramics. Steels vary, but generally how many strokes are you doing at each grit?

Are you following your edge at every stage with a good loupe? This is the most helpful diagnostic tool I own. It lets me see exactly what is going on, both on the bevel and at the edge.

How’s your pressure? I start with only the weight of the stones and lighten it as I go. By the last few dozen passes of any stone, it’s just a gentle kiss.
[/quote]
Number of strokes varies a lot, somewhere between 30-150 strokes per grit I’d say. Mostly I listen, look and feel. I’m using both a loupe (40x) and an USB microscope (400x) and from what I can see I get a nice uniform scratch pattern with no real visible or deeper scratches between diamond stones. But I also think it can be hard sometimes to really see if all scratches from before is actually gone since they are all in the same direction (and that is probably what I notice later when using the MicroFines).

For sure I’m using more pressure than that to begin with, I probably end every stone with the pressure you start with (the weight of the stone). So this is something I will have to try…

Then again, the whole scratch removal is just cosmetics since I have no problem getting hair whittling or tree topping sharp edges which is the real objective. And I can actually get enough of a mirror finish as well (reading back fine print text and so on) but it just takes a lot of scrubbing with the MicroFine ceramics.

[quote quote=“KenBuzbee” post=10753]I hope any of this helps?
[/quote]
Yes it definitely helps with any and all input from more experienced WEPSers, I’m still new to the tool.