Wicked Edge GO, deluxe bag, and bundle package
- This topic has 35 replies, 18 voices, and was last updated 12/27/2017 at 12:33 pm by
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Clay: Have you ever made a prototype with magnets?
Tom,
I have made a few with magnets and haven’t have much issue with filings. If it turns out to be a problem, we could consider a dust cover, like a strip of Swiffer cloth to collect the filings that could go between the handle and the stones. I like the idea of opposite poles on the ends of the handle to magnetize the steel. I’ll play with that. I agree about the interference issue – it goes away without the tray to hold the stone. There are lots of ways to achieve that while still protecting fingers. It turns out that taking a sharp knife and cutting a bevel away from the outside tops of the trays does the trick pretty well too. So we can play with those concepts.
-Clay
I don’t think loss in speed is much of an issue. I still believe a more simple approach is better. It’s less expensive, less complicated and more accurate. A handle with improved trueness in dimensions, tighter tolerance bushings, no tray so no interference to Ricasso and a more efficient pair selection/combination is my preference.
Anything fancier is more chance to introduce error. When you remove, change, reattach, you have essentially more moving parts and more opportunities for inaccuracies, for wear and break downs. It’s also got to be more expensive.
Plus, it’ll work with every system still out there; old and new. As users choose to change over or replace their stones it’s a smaller investment which can be made more slowly over time as is necessary.
That being said any upgrades, enhancements or improvements, I’m in. I’ve bought everything offered up to this point wanting to stay with the “cutting edge” (pun intended) in knife sharpening.
Marc
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One feature that is nice with the two sided handles is that changing grits is really fast between the two sides. That feature will be lost with removable stones. Do you guys feel like that loss in speed is important?
Truth be told I will miss the speed factor, but the other benefits may make up for it. I think some of it would depend on getting the right strength of magnets where it’s just enough strength to hold the stone, but not so much that you have to wrestle with it to switch them out.
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Another factor to consider with the old type stone VS say a magnetic changeable stone is, the old style the feel is very rigid and solid and allows for good feel or feed-back through the stone while sharpening. With a less solid stone/handle interphase using magnets I think that feed-back would be less positive, certainly, different.
Maybe another solution that’s non-magnetic would be abrasive stones with a couple threaded posts that insert into corresponding threaded holes in the handle, then a key like a skate key in the side that when turned would draw in and hold tight the two side stones when twisted. Both side abrasives could be simultaneously held tight by two screws, either both on the same side or one inserted to each side to keep the weight balanced. The side screws would be counter sunk below the finger grips so as not to be felt. This type of fastener setup is commonly used in manufactured furniture that needs to be assembled.
Marc
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As someone who sharpens for the enjoyment of the activity (and the sharp knives, obviously) rather than someone who need a sharp knife ASAP (professional chef / butcher, hunter dressing game in the field, sharpening for money), I would say that a few extra seconds spent on a grit change is of no consequence. If I’m investing an hour into a single knife I don’t worry about a minute or two total extra time.
I’m not convinced that there would be a net loss in time. If the new paddle design had the built in angle gauges and there was no measurable play in the stone / rod, the extra time spent on swapping diamond plates might be made up for by spending less time on adjustments and not needing to do as many strokes to remove errant scratches resulting from the play in the rod / paddle junction.
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Having ordered the GO I think that 100/200, 400/600, 800/1000 with one set of leather strops either 4/2 emulsion or 5/3.5 paste would be the combination that I would prefer. The Idea of 200/400 then 600/800 and one set of strops 5/3.5 on leather would be a very good combination as well I think. The 800 finish is a great working edge and refining that with the strops takes it to a different level of sharp. For entry level sharpener or as a field sharpener the 200 thru 800 stones with the strops would help keep the price down and give very good results as well in my opinion. I would upgrade my purchase to that combination. I have the PP3 with a really great case so if I want my full arsenal I can pack that up and travel with it as well but the go will be much easier for travel and the PP3 is a little cumbersome for the field.
Don’t really think the pro paddles are the way to go in a GO package but might be great to offer as stand alone options for any system you may all ready have.
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Well, as usual, I got the itch with regard to the magnetic handles idea, so I had to put one together…
First, I milled (planed, actually) a stick of 1″ X 1″ ABS down to 0.935″ thick, figuring that the stones are an average of 0.125″ thick. The target for from face to face distance is 1.187″. 1.187″ minus 0.25″.
I machined four 1/2″ diameter by 0.125″ deep pockets to hold the neodymium magnets I had on hand. On the first side, I used a router table, as it has a relatively accurate vertical adjustment. Unfortunately, the lowest speed of my router was still too fast for ABS and the plastic melted in the center of the bore, even though I had pre-drilled it to 1/4″ diameter.
The opposite side of the handle was drilled with a 1/2″ diameter Forstner bit. The ABS didn’t like that either and the holes were slightly over-sized, making some form of glue necessary, and the depth was harder to control, requiring a bit of shim stock to make them even.
The magnet had to be pressed in on the router side, and would probably need to be glued in on the Forstner side.
On both sides, the magnet faces protrude slightly from the handle, resulting in a slightly larger distance from the center of the guide rod bore. It did not, however, appear to make the stone faces unstable. They are solid and would not move around without some deliberate external force being applied.
You can easily slide the stones off to the side, or for that matter, to the end, when needed to change stones.
I added a screw-driver notch on each side. The photos below show that capability. Although this worked quite well, I think I’d prefer to push the stone off toward one end or the other. If you lift the stone away from the magnets, they’ll find out some way of pinching you to see if you scream like a girly.
In use, I don’t see any reason why the magnet-held stones wouldn’t work just fine. One simple change to address any concerns about stone position would be to add a very small raised section along the edges to keep the stone centered on the handle. Imagine the current handle design without the raised edges at the ends.
No, I don’t have this handle configured so that I could actually test it in use. Meanwhile, I be glad to answer any questions.
Here’s the first photo showing the handle without stones:
Next shows a stone attached, but turned to show the magnets and the notch for the screw-driver removal:
Next is the mounted stone, showing how a screwdriver could be used to lift the stone off of the magnet faces:
And last is showing how rotating the screwdriver (very little effort required) would break the magnetic hold, allowing the user to remove the stone:
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Clay, whatever you do with the Pro GO kit, please just keep it Compact I am a professional sharpener while at home but 1/2 the year offshore so I would love to bring one offshore with me
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Well, as usual, I got the itch with regard to the magnetic handles idea, so I had to put one together…
Magnets make stone a debris collector. Metal dust will be all over the stone. I doubt it is a good idea.
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I’ll throw in my .02… fwiw….
200/600 is a great “2 step” sharpening combo… and meets the purpose that Clay mentioned earlier… coarse stone to shape an edge, and a fine stone to refine it a bit… quick and get back to work. The basics of most sharpeners uses this simple 2-step process… which is what I thought the intention of the Go was. 200/400 is too close to be beneficial. Some of you are basically “building” what is already available, and trying to make a sharpener that will do it all. Give the 200/600 combo a try on a few knives, and I think you’ll start to realize its potential. Keep in mind that you’re not always looking to obtain the “best” edge, and you’re not trying to necessarily remove all the 200g with the 600g… just an edge that is shaped, refined a bit, burr free, and will do the job. If you need more than this… there are other models for that. Not to say you can’t get the Go, and build on it if you want… but it shouldn’t start out that way. (Heck, I’d even do a 100/600… depending on the condition of the knives I mostly saw…).
Magnets… use the magnet to hold the stone to the blank… but not to hold the stone in place. It doesn’t need to be very strong to do this. Even with the current WE stones… with the raised edge all around the stone… one or two “low power” magnets will do the job, and will reduce the chance of the buildup of filings, etc. If you’re prying stones off with a screwdriver, having to slide them off, etc…. too much. (But please, if you do a redesign… get rid of the lip….. it’s like the bezel on a cell phone)…..
Willis68… probably hit the nail on the head… in one sentence.
Great ideas, guys, the magnetic stones. At least when you want it to take up little room; it seems a great idea for the GO. I’m not a mechanical engineer, so it’s hard for me to judge these ideas, but my first impression is definitely very good.
Molecule Polishing: my blog about sharpening with the Wicked Edge
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I’ll throw in my .02… fwiw…. 200/600 is a great “2 step” sharpening combo… and meets the purpose that Clay mentioned earlier… coarse stone to shape an edge, and a fine stone to refine it a bit… quick and get back to work. The basics of most sharpeners uses this simple 2-step process… which is what I thought the intention of the Go was. 200/400 is too close to be beneficial. Some of you are basically “building” what is already available, and trying to make a sharpener that will do it all. Give the 200/600 combo a try on a few knives, and I think you’ll start to realize its potential. Keep in mind that you’re not always looking to obtain the “best” edge, and you’re not trying to necessarily remove all the 200g with the 600g… just an edge that is shaped, refined a bit, burr free, and will do the job. If you need more than this… there are other models for that. Not to say you can’t get the Go, and build on it if you want… but it shouldn’t start out that way. (Heck, I’d even do a 100/600… depending on the condition of the knives I mostly saw…).
I agree and actually think that the 50/80 grit stones would be better suited for the GO bundle than any of the higher stones (800/1000 and up) after watching Clay reprofile the chipped pairing knife in his recent video.
@wickededge how do we upgrade our pre-order to one of these bundles?
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I would also love to know how to upgrade the pre-order bundles.
We haven’t decided on any bundled kits yet, but we will make the deluxe bags available soon.
-Clay
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