Shapton vs. Chosera WEPS Stones – The Great Debate

[jeff williams]

Just wondering if an aircraft quality Heim joint would work?
or am I just thinking out loud and need to shut up B)

[Dan]

All it took was a little oil! I was working down at the sporting goods store I work/play at on weekends, and I had brought the WEPS down to show it off a bit. I decided to just hit it with a little Kroil on the pivots to see what would happen, and low and behold the sticking feeling is COMPLETELY gone. Apparently, it was just the aluminium surfaces rubbing against each other, and a bit of oil smoothed things up nicely. I’ll probably use a grease or a more surface-clinging oil in place of a penetrating oil the next time it starts to need it, but it’s what I had handy and it solved the problem!

The Shaptons are performing very well, now that I have the final set of diamond plates to set up the scratch pattern for them properly, they’re making one heck of an edge. In retrospect I might have made a better choice on this paddle set with a 2K/5K set, instead of a 1K/2K. The 1K sure smooths out the diamond scratches quickly, though. My next move will probably be to get some better magnification so I can actually inspect what it’s doing in real time to make sure I’m cleaning up all the coarser grit marks before I move on. The edge is not a polished one off of the 2K, there’s no mirror yet, but it’s certainly sharp!

[Jende Industries]

Good news all around, Komit!

I think you made the better choice in the long run for a 1K/2K coming straight off the WEPS 600. I did a microscope progression with the WEPS diamonds, then the WEPS ceramic 1200/1600 and jumped to the Chosera 5K, which I’m writing up on my blog (hopefully it will be ready in a couple of days..) Jumping straight from the 600 WEPS to the 2K Shapton can mask the deepest scratches of the 400, 200 and 100 WEPS diamonds if you used them, unless you spent more time making sure they were removed. When touching up in the future, you can then begin at the 2K.

Your next paddle can be a 5K/Balsa or leather strop 😉

BTW, the 2K Shapton will only ever produce a hazy finish at best – never a mirror. You can, however, get a slight mirror off the 2K Chosera if you work the mud enough.

That’s another difference that I’ve been noticing on the WEPS in particular (not so much on the full sized stones) – one of the advantages to the Choseras is that they do hold water, allowing them to stay wet longer during use, and using the mud as the stone dries is advantageous, whereas on the Shaptons the water does tend to drip off the stones quicker, and the resulting swarf on the stone hampers performance.

I also got my Diamond WEPS 800/1K- so I’ll be getting to those soon. B)

[Dan]

I’m working them off of the WEPS 1K now that I have it handy, actually. It worked off of the 600, which kind of surprised me given the jump in grit size, especially with the larger grit particles being diamond.

I’ve noticed that with the hazy finish, Tom, but I wasn’t really expecting a shine off of a 2K anyway. Once I get the 5K/8K some time this coming month, THEN I will start to see a shine. 🙂 I’ve been just using a spray bottle like you’d use for window cleaner full of water with a few drops of Dawn to keep them wet, a squirt every little bit seems to clear the swarf and re-wet the stone nicely.

[Marion]

Now you have reminded me of a question I think of everytime I go the distance with my stones. Should I be wetting or oiling the WE Ceramic stones when using them?

[ToJo]

I just received mine today and wondering the same thing.

[Jende Industries]

Now you have reminded me of a question I think of everytime I go the distance with my stones. Should I be wetting or oiling the WE Ceramic stones when using them?

I do believe the Wicked Edge ceramic 1200 and 1600 paddles are meant to be used dry. I recommend periodically cleaning the paddles with clean water and a scrub brush. Using them dry collects the dust and swarf in the pores of the stone making it less aggressive.

Shaptons and Choseras should only ever use water, BTW.

[Leo James Mitchell]

You believe correctly Tom. The ceramics should be used dry…and cleaning them every so often is excellent advice.

Cheers
Leo

[ToJo]

Thanks for the info,

[Dave Schur]

I usually clean my ceramics every 10 knives or so with a still brush and soapy water. I will sometimes do the diamonds at the same time.

Recently I have switched to Barkeepers Friend as I had some on hand anyway and I saw someone suggested it. I found it to work even better restoring the ceramics, but little difference on the diamonds.

[Dan]

BKF works great on ceramics in general, I use it to keep my Sharpmaker rods clean and clear of swarf.

Probably will have no effect at all on the diamond plates, they don’t retain swarf the way a ceramic will.

[Larry]

What is this bar keepers friend you guys talk about, I never had heard of it before, I just use a little comet to clean the ceramics.

Lucky

[Dan]

It is a powdered cleanser very similar to Comet, except that it has a very mild acid in it that actually eats the swarf due to it’s huge surface area. Oxalic acid, if I recall correctly.

[Ronald Stenbro]

Dumb question, though, is anyone else getting kind of a binding, “sticking at the corners” feeling from the pivots? It’s almost like the little universals are twisting against each other and not turning smoothly. Think I might need to add a dab of high-pressure grease to the joints.

Off topic, but…

I’m having exactly that problem with one of the arms. The other one is super smooth at all angles. It’s extremely aggravating because it slows everything down. It gets stuck on every stroke and I have to futz with/wiggle it to get it to release. I think it has to do with the tightness of the pivot (black piece near setscrew). On the smooth arm, there is no play at all, and on the bad one it sits very loose within it’s seat (socket?). It’s as if the play allows it twist and bind on the edge. I’m hoping I can get a whole new arm assembly. It not only affects the smoothness of sharpening, but when I extend both arms out to the side and measure with an angle gauge, the sticky arm sits a full 6 degrees lower than the smooth arm. That can’t be good. As I said… aggravating.

I thought about trying some grease or lubricant, but I figured it would just get caked with metalic dust and actually be worse in the long run.

EDIT: Just read the rest of the comments. Microlon? Gonna have to Google that. 🙂

[Dan]

I just added a drop of Kroil myself, it’s a fairly standard penetrating oil, and is definitely NOT ideal as a lubricant. I figure that if mine ever starts getting too caked up with gunk, I’ll just take them to the sink and scrub ’em down with some Simple Green to take it all off, then add another drop of oil.

It took care of the problem entirely for me. I’ve now actually got just a tad bit of “Slick 50” Teflon-bearing lube on them.

[Author]

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