Function vs Cosmetics

[sksharp]

I was wondering how important is was to some how the knife functions vs how it looks. The sharpest edges that I have achieved have not been the prettiest edges that I’ve done. Just curious on some of your thoughts on this.

[Snecx]

Do you mean pretty by having a scratch-less mirror polish? For some knives I really like mirror polish, so I’ll go through the pain.

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sksharp

[Marc H]

For me sharpness trumps pretty.  I believe as I progress up the grits maintaining my technique the scratches are obliterated by sequential finer grits and when I decide it’s sharp enough so time to strop the bevel is pretty dang reflective with only a few minimal scratches.

Marc
(MarcH's Rack-Its)

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sksharp

[sksharp]

Snecx wrote:

Do you mean pretty by having a scratch-less mirror polish? For some knives I really like mirror polish, so I’ll go through the pain.

I too have a couple of knives with a cosmetically pleasant look (mirrored) but I have not yet done an edge that is completely blemish free. Minor blemishes that are not necessarily visible to the naked eye unless you play with the lighting to find them, IE moving the knife under a fluorescent light looking for imperfections or with 10-14 x triplet. For me an edge can look good without being mirrored, consistent, even scratching but if the knife is sharp with a few noticeable imperfections I call it good in most cases.

I was curious if the look of the edge was more or as important to many of us as the sharpness and cutting ability of the knife. I’ve sharpened for a dozen or so people now and have not had one of them say anything but how good they look even though there are imperfections that I have noticed and all of them love the way the knives perform. I have on occasion went through the pain to put the best looking edge I could do, but those knives are basically for show more than for every day use as I’ve found they are very time consuming to maintain. Cut anything harder than soft vegetables or paper and they don’t look nearly as good as before.

I’m not looking for absolutes, just for insight as to how some of you out there determine what the best edge for a particular knife should be. We seem to talk a lot about “mirroring” and less it seems to me about techniques for putting purpose edges on knives. Less refined edges left with more teeth seem to do a much better job on say meats and tougher materials than a more refined mirrored edge, it seems to me, so that is how I sharpen them with the purpose and user in mind. If a knife is going to be used by anyone but myself I want to put a durable and sharp edge on because I know that they most likely will not be maintained the same way I would.

I do understand wanting a knife to look good especially for more expensive EDC’s and kitchen knives. In a few instances I have sharpened them with the look of the edge in mind from the beginning but I’m still up in the air if the “edge” is any better and in some cases I’m sure they would work better for there intended purpose without the mirrored edge. The 8″ chefs knife in my kitchen that I use 75% of the time is not remarkable looking but is my go to knife in the kitchen. The EDC that I prefer to carry, Buck Vantage Force Pro, with S30V steal is also not a remarkable looking edge but I promise you it does what I want it to do.

These are just some of the thoughts that roll around in my pea brain and was curious as to the thought process of you folks on how you determine an edge for certain knives.

Thanks Guys

 

 

[Snecx]

I can get my kitchen knives plenty sharp with some 8×3 benchstones and a strop. It’s much quicker too. Generally shaving sharp is easily achievable. For some occasions, I’ll just whip out the Sharpmaker.

Wicked Edge is usually reserved for the time when I desire the sharpest edge and the most consistent bevel. Usually the “look” is one of the reasons why I’d use WE.

And I agree, sometimes it’s easier to just stop at 1500 grit for example, with uniform scratch pattern. Perhaps with slight polishing from the ceramic. It will still look finished.

I will always aim for HHT-3 level of sharpness or better when I use WE. My dilemma has been with mirror edges, a lot of polishing sort of drop the level of sharpness a little, but still passes the HHT.

And I’ll be trying the diamond lapping films next, maybe that will solve it!

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sksharp

[tcmeyer]

Until the Pro Pack 2 came out, the basic WEPS was shipped with only 100/200’s and 400/600’s.  I remember thinking at the time that these were the sharpest knives I had ever sharpened.  The fact is that the apex was perfect, with a wonderful, toothy edge,  I also recall a testimonial I read on Josh’s RazorEdgeKnives website where a fellow had his knife done by Josh to 600 grit and he was ecstatic about it.  If you want to disassemble a moose, a good hunting knife with a 600-grit edge is pretty impressive.

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[cbwx34]

Best of both worlds?…

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378pete, dulledge, Marc H, sksharp

[sksharp]

I couldn’t agree more TC. For hunting knives the 600 diamond or 400 wet stone edge is a great edge and seems to hold up real well. Thanks TC

Thanks Snecx good stuff. When you do get the lapping films and get a chance to use them I’ll be interested to hear what you think of them.

 

[sksharp]

cbwx34 wrote:

Best of both worlds?… <iframe src=”https://www.youtube.com/embed/e4w0LqdMcGM?feature=oembed&#8221; width=”670″ height=”377″ frameborder=”0″ allowfullscreen=”allowfullscreen”></iframe>

I use the micro or secondary bevel quite a bit for a lot of different knives but, never in quite that way with that much tooth. Interesting!

Normally I use the same stone that I finish with. Got to give that technique a go!

Thanks cbwx34

[Rich]

Would there be any benefit/detriment to having/not having the mirror on the secondary bevel?  It seems (I haven not performed this experiment YET), that the tooth of the primary bevel coupled with the reduction in friction (mirror) on the secondary bevel would benefit about every situation imaginable.  Rope/zip ties/field dressing an animal/cooking/etc…

Has anyone performed a test of this theory?

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sksharp

[Marc H]

Rich to understand you easier, could you clarify the terminology you’re using?  Are you calling the “primary bevel” the original cutting edge that the knife came with from the maker?  Is what you’re calling the “secondary bevel” an added micro-bevel used to improve longevity and durability of the cutting edge?  If that is how you are using them, others and myself have stropped the secondary micro-bevel.  In my opinion, stropping it does improve it’s cutting feel by removing some toothyness and friction, along with making it smoother and shinier.  This secondary, micro-bevel is very tiny if applied how I think it’s intended to be applied and barely discernable at the very edge of the cutting edge on a mirror polished sharpened knife.  I’m reiterating  Just about every thing Clay says in his video linked above.

Marc
(MarcH's Rack-Its)

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sksharp

[Mark76]

I think it is really subjective. I used to sharpen knives for a restaurant and asked every cook what finish they wanted. Guess what… it varied from 800 grit to 10,000… Personally I like to mix function and functionality, too. I have a couple of Laguiole knives one of which I always take with me to a restaurant and even though a rougher knife may cut better, I always like to take a mirror polished knife there with me.

Molecule Polishing: my blog about sharpening with the Wicked Edge

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sksharp

[uilleann]

My 2 cents…. All of my Kitchen knives are sharpend for sharpness.  I bring them through all of the diamond stones up to 1500 and then maybe a 6 micron diamond tape.  Its a semi-mirror finish but very sharp.  I do no between stone edge inspections and just go from stone to stone.  Takes me about 15-20 minutes.

My pocket folders are a different story.  I want them sharp and I want them pretty.  They get the same diamonds but with inspections and clean up between stones, then the choseras, then a series of diamond films.  Never proceeding if any abnormal scratches are left.  Those take 2-4 hours to do.

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[dulledge]

Lately for kitchen knives I make 300 grit main bevel at 15 degrees and then lightly hone 3 strokes per side on 12″ ceramic rod for micro bevel at 20 degrees. It slices tomatoes and flesh beautifully. Light honing makes it sharp again in a few seconds.

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sksharp

[Rich]

As I understand, the primary bevel would be the cutting edge (apex). A micro bevel would be the primary bevel. The secondary bevel is the majority of the edge (everything less the micro bevel).  Is this correct or am I backwards?

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sksharp

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