A theory of how the WE diamond pastes work

[wickededge]

Only 50 strokes were required to obtain a very smooth edge. The 200 more I did were really not necessary.

I guess the next step would to see how many exactly. Maybe going from the 1000# diamonds or the 1600# ceramics and only doing 10 strokes before imagining.

-Clay

[Mark76]

I guess the next step would to see how many exactly. Maybe going from the 1000# diamonds or the 1600# ceramics and only doing 10 strokes before imagining.

That is a good one. There is a noticeable difference, however, between using the strops after the 1000 grit stones and using them after the 1600 grit stones. They nicely smoothed out the 1000 grit scratches, but these scratches were still well visible. However, when used after the 1600 grit stones, the 1600 grit scratches nearly got wiped out.

I am starting to wonder whether the WE paste loaded strops are perhaps the ideal means to prevent the “overhoning effect” (coarse sratches becoming apparent only when sharpening with fine stones) that Tom has described. I.e. do some stropping after the 1600 grit stones before going to the high grit Choseras or Shaptons.

I know it sounds weird, but this topic has surprised me before… What do you think?

Molecule Polishing: my blog about sharpening with the Wicked Edge

[wickededge]

I.e. do some stropping after the 1600 grit stones before going to the high grit Choseras or Shaptons.

That’s an interesting thought. I sometimes do something similar when I’m studying grits; I polish and smooth the edge until it’s near perfect, then go straight to the grit I want to study so I’m sure that what I’m seeing is exactly the grit in question.

-Clay

[wickededge]

Okay, for fun, I decided to do a preliminary study of stroke numbers with the strops,using the 14um diamond pastes right after the 1600 ceramic stones. I did 10 strokes per side before taking each picture:

1600# Ceramics

14um – 10 strokes

14um 20 strokes

more to come…

Attachments:

• 1600grit.jpg
• 14um10strokes.jpg
• 14um20strokes.jpg

-Clay

[wickededge]

14um – 30 strokes

14um- 40 strokes

14um – 50 strokes

Attachments:

• 14um30strokes.jpg
• 14um40strokes.jpg
• 14um50strokes.jpg

-Clay

[Mark76]

This is what we call fast and furious, Clay! :woohoo:

I just realized I made an error in my description of the blog post: the smoothing out of the scratches appeared after a 100 strokes, not 50. And with the 5 micron paste after the 1600 grit stones (a previous blog post) I could still see improvement after 250 strokes, likely due to the better lighting.

But your results will be much more conclusive: not only more pictures, but also a better picture quality and great lighting.

Molecule Polishing: my blog about sharpening with the Wicked Edge

[wickededge]

Onward with the studies 🙂

The next five images are very interesting; I went back to the 1600# ceramic and recreated the scratch pattern, then went to the 3.5um Diamond and Leather strops with the following sequence: 50 strokes/side> 100 strokes/side> 150 strokes/side> 200 strokes/side:

1600# Ceramics

3.5um – 50 strokes

3.5um – 100 strokes

More to come… 🙂

Attachments:

• 1600grit-secondround.jpg
• 3.5um50strokes.jpg
• 3.5um100strokes.jpg

-Clay

[wickededge]

and onward:

3.5um – 150 strokes

3.5um – 200

The 1600# ceramics took a little chunk out of the edge and it’s easy to track through the pictures exactly how the strops are working on the surface and edge.

Attachments:

• 3.5um150strokes.jpg
• 3.5um200strokes.jpg

-Clay

[wickededge]

Time for curveballs! I wanted to test cutting performance and I wanted to add in the 5k and 10k Choseras to the mix, so I reestablished the 1600# scratch pattern from the ceramic stones:

1600# Ceramics

Then I used the 5k Choseras:

5k Choseras – 100 strokes
I wasn’t quite hitting the edge, so I did another 100 strokes:

5k Choseras – 200 strokes

Next batch will be the 10k Choseras.

Attachments:

• 1600Grit-3rdRound.jpg
• 5k-100strokes.jpg
• 5k-200strokes.jpg

-Clay

[wickededge]

On to the 10k Choseras:

10k Choseras – 100 strokes The edge is interesting here…

From the 10k stones, I went on to the strops, first the 1 micron Diamond on Balsa strops:

1um Diamond on Balsa Strops – 100 strokes

.5um Diamond on Balsa Strops – 100 strokes

Attachments:

• 10k-100strokes.jpg
• 1umDiamondonBalsaafter10k-100strokes.jpg
• 5umDiamondonBalsa-100strokes.jpg

-Clay

[wickededge]

On to the small stuff, it gets weird from here…

.25um CBN on Horsebutt (Split) – 100 strokes

.125um CBN on Horsebutt (Split) – 100 strokes

.125um CBN on Horsebutt (Top) – 100 Strokes

more to come….

Attachments:

• 25umDiamondonHorsebutt-100strokes.jpg
• 125umCBNonHorsebuttSplit-100strokes.jpg
• 125umCBNonHorsebuttTop-100strokes.jpg

-Clay

[wickededge]

Continuing weirdness:

Plain Horsebutt Leather (Top) – 100 strokes

.5um Diamond on Cow Leather (Top) – 100 strokes
I wish I’d cleaned the blade for this photo….

Plain Cow Leather (Top) – 100 strokes

and finally

.125um CBN on Cow Leather (Top) – 100 strokes

Attachments:

• PlainHorsebuttTop.jpg
• 5umDiamondonCowLeatherTop-100strokes.jpg
• PlainCowLeatherTop.jpg
• 125umCBNonCowLeatherTop-100strokes.jpg

-Clay

[Phil Pasteur]

Interesting…
First, thanks Clay for all of this! it is real nice to be able to see what is happening with these progressions.

The 10K Chosera edge is interesting because it seems to be non-uniform or maybe a bit uneven.Not sure how to describe it. Curious, so far I have liked the edge that this stone leaves. Though I must say that I have almost always gone to the leather strops at 1 micron diamond and .5 micron CBN after the 10K.

It it my imagination or is the 1 micron diamond bevel showing fewer scratches than the 0.5 micron bevel.
At this magnification it seems hard to tell which “edge of the edge” is better, but I am leaning towards the 1 micron edge.

I wish that I could get photos that are even close to the quality that you obtain.

What do others think?

Phil

BTW, just saw the last photos. It looks like the horse butt is some abrasive stuff. Interesting that there are all kinds of stories out there on the razor forums about how superior it is to other stropping media!

[wickededge]

For each stage in the latest progression, I repeated the same tests – hanging hair test (HHT) and copy paper push cut (CPPC). Below are the results, in order of the progressions:
[table]
[tr][td]Medium[/td][td]HHT[/td][td]CPPC[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]1600# Ceramic[/td][td]Fail[/td][td]Pass, slight fraying of the edges[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]5k Chosera[/td][td]Fail[/td][td]Pass, slight fraying of the edges[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]10k Chosera[/td][td]Fail[/td][td]Pass, very smooth cut[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]1um Diamond on Balsa[/td][td]Fail[/td][td]Pass, very smooth cut[/td][/tr]
[tr][td].5um Diamond on Balsa[/td][td]Fail[/td][td]Pass, very smooth cut[/td][/tr]
[tr][td].25um Diamond on Horsebutt (Split)[/td][td]Fail[/td][td]Pass, very smooth cut[/td][/tr]
[tr][td].125um Diamond on Horsebutt (Split)[/td][td]Fail[/td][td]Pass, very smooth cut[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Plain Horsebutt (Top)[/td][td]Pass[/td][td]Pass, very smooth cut[/td][/tr]
[tr][td].5um Diamond on Cow Leather (Top)[/td][td]Pass[/td][td]Pass, very smooth cut[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Plain Cow Leather (Top)[/td][td]Pass[/td][td]Pass, very smooth cut[/td][/tr]
[tr][td].125um CBN on Cow Leather (Top)[/td][td]Pass[/td][td]Pass, very smooth cut[/td][/tr]
[/table]
I was surprised by these results, especially how well the plain top leather, both cow and horsebutt did with the hanging hair test, even more so considering the difference in scratches.

What I think I’ve learned so far from this exercise (and from regular usage) is that there is a lot to be said for the common (on this forum anyway) wisdom about applying different finishes for different usages e.g. the super smooth finishes that we get from the strops are not ideal for when I’m butchering meat, specifically all the very fine work of trimming silverskin and connective tissue – for that, a finish of 3k or 5k really works the best. Clearly if I want to cut hanging hairs, I need to finish with plain leather. It’s almost mind boggling (but loads of fun!)

I’m a little concerned about the 10k image and I’ll need to redo that one to rule out poor technique and/or surface contaminants. I’ll wash the stones well and give it another run, starting with a super smooth finish.

-Clay

[Mark76]

Wooh! That is a great series. And cutting tests as well.

That 1 micron diamond paste after the 10K Choseras makes a smooth edge…

And then it is weird that the .5 micron paste seems to make scratches again.

The results with split horse leather are strange. The .25 micron stuff on split horse leather seems to make even wider scratches than the .5 micron stuff. But then the .125 stuff seems to smoothen the edge again… Could it be the lighting? Or contamination?

What strikes me is that the .125 scratches seem much more apparent after the top horse leather than after the split horse leather. But after the cow leather they are hardly visible. Lighting? Or are we running into the limitations of the microscope?

Your post does seem to show that the smoothest edge is not necessarily the sharpest (also not for push cutting or the HHT). Or do I interpret things wrongly?

I’d be interested to see what that plain top horse butt leather does to a completely clean edge, compared to plain top cow leather. Some straight razor honers like top horse leather[/url] because it apparently has silicates in it already by itself. And your first HHT pass was after the top horse leather.

Molecule Polishing: my blog about sharpening with the Wicked Edge

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