Small knife / low angle adapter

[fvdk]

On Bladeforums, while discussing sharpening small knifes with the Wicked Edge, I mentioned that I thought about modifying an old Lansky clamp to be used as an alternative for the WE Low Angle Adapter.

As it turned out, I was not the first one to have this idea and Curtis (cbwx34) replied with a picture of a modified Gatco clamp that he had send to Clay a couple of years ago.

The original WE low angle adapter could be a suitable option for a lot of knives, especially tactical folders with wider blades and kitchen knives but it is not ideal for smaller blades as those of many traditional folders, standard Victorinox or even smaller pen blades.

The Tormek SVM-00 adapter could be another option but for smaller knives I have always used the original Lansky that I bought more than 30 years ago so I decided to see how well it would work with the WE and this is how it turned out.

Curtis replied with a picture that shows a cardboard mock-up of another possible enhancement so the centre of the adapter is in line with the WE vise.

I am very pleased with the result and it works very well with most of my pocket knifes but I think that with a few enhancements it could even be better and make an excellent original WE small knife / low angle attachment.

The small notch in the clamp is what makes it work so well for smaller knives but Lansky as well as others, made several versions of their clamp and although very similar, some work well and give a very secure grip while others barely hold the knife.

Here are a few clamps from my collection

The original 1980’s Lansky and the Loray clamp are my favorites as they have a very fine notch that even hold the very small Victorinox SD classic blades.

What I do like about the Smith’s clamp, is that it has a tapered notch which very well suits Full Flat and hollow grind blades but it is too deep for the small pen blades.

My ideal combination would be a clamp with 12.5 degree angled jaws and a very small (3 mm deep / 0.8mm wide) 8 degree tapered notch with holes for the WE depth key.

The notch would be perfect for FFG and Hollow grind Victorinox and traditional style knives (even the small Victorinox SD blades) while the depth key could be used to clamp larger knives just like in the standard vise.

Frans

[mark76]

Thanks for posting this, Frans! I hope this can stir a discussion here in which forum members can perhaps give more suggestions for improvement.

Could you tell us whether the Lansky attachments (original and new) can sharpen a victorinox knife without the paddles hitting the vise? (You wrote the original attachment can, but the new one not?)

And when you clamp a knife like in your second picture, its center is off. I know you can correct that with the angle cube, but did you find easier ways?

And am I correct in assuming these attachments would work well with small and thin knives like a Victorinox, but not with higher or thicker knives like outdoor knives or chef knives?

Thanks again for posting this innovative idea!

[fvdk]

Thanks for posting this, Frans! I hope this can stir a discussion here in which forum members can perhaps give more suggestions for improvement. Could you tell us whether the Lansky attachments (original and new) can sharpen a victorinox knife without the paddles hitting the vise? (You wrote the original attachment can, but the new one not?)

I am not sure if you mean hitting the Lansky clamp or hitting the WE vise but with a small blade as in my first picture, the stones stay well away from the WE vise and do not hit the Lansky clamp either.

There was a problem with newer type Lansky clamps with rubber inserts but all the clamps with the small notch can sharpen small blades without hitting the clamp.

And when you clamp a knife like in your second picture, its center is off. I know you can correct that with the angle cube, but did you find easier ways? And am I correct in assuming these attachments would work well with small and thin knives like a Victorinox, but not with higher or thicker knives like outdoor knives or chef knives? Thanks again for posting this innovative idea!

Actually, the knife in the picture is aligned with the left side of the WE vise and therefor just 1mm off-center. Precise adjustments can of course be made with the angle cube but in general you would use the same method as using the original vise.

It would certainly work with higher or thicker knives as well but you would probably not use the small notch and clamp them deeper but than you have no depth reference hence my suggestion for holes so the WE depth key can be used.

[wickededge]

This is really interesting, thanks for posting it. What issues are you having with the Wicked Edge Low Angle Adapter? Are you not getting low enough angles? Don’t like that it’s not centered? Anything else?

[fvdk]

This is really interesting, thanks for posting it. What issues are you having with the Wicked Edge Low Angle Adapter? Are you not getting low enough angles? Don’t like that it’s not centered? Anything else?

I do not have an Wicked Edge LAA. I Never bought one for a couple of reasons. I will try to describe them but English is not my native language so I hope it will all make sense.

When I thought about buying one, I noticed that the notch in the LAA is pretty deep, by the looks of it, even deeper than the notch in the Smith’s clamp in my picture. This would mean that small and usually full flat ground blades are not easy to clamp in such a way that they do not wiggle. More or less the same problem as clamping FFG blades in the standard vise. This video I found on Youtube also shows the problem https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FHX61wEIARE

 

• The depth of the notch in the LAA would also mean that smaller blades (< 1/2" ) sit so deep that it is probably not possible to get low angles (lower than 20dps). You could try to place the blade higher in the clamp but that probably would not work very well and you would loose the depth reference.
• Looking at my picture of the different clamps, all the notches look very similar but in practice there is a real difference. The very narrow, ever so slightly tapered notch of the original 80's clamp, combined with the lever action make it clamp so tight to a Victorinox blade that I can rock/twist the handle of the knife without any wiggle of the blade in the clamp. The slightly wider notch of the new 2016 clamp gives it just a little bit less clamping force.

• The price of the LAA here in the Netherlands is € 118.- / $ 133.- This is of course not something Wicked Edge is to blame for but it was a bit too much for me just to give it a try. For the record, I think that the US price of $75.- is a very fair price.

If the notch in the Smith's clamp would be half as deep, it would probably be my favorite but as it is now, it is still my original Lansky clamp and I even use it for blades as small as these

I think that from the beginning, the LAA was really designed to be a low angle adapter for large knives and not as much a small knife adapter but it could be both.

 

[mark76]

Thanks Frans. My experience with the LAA adapter is that it works great on most types of knives. Only, as you remarked, if the knife is very small, like a small Victorinox, the stones may hit the WE clamp. I currently use the Tormek LAA adapter for this. And I was wondering whether this Lansky clamp might be an alternative to this.

I have a hard time imagining why the new Lansky vise doesn’t work for this purpose. I don’t even see a rubber insert in the vise on your pictures (I do see something that looks more like a notch at the top of the vise. Is that the rubber? And if it is, what is the problem with it?). In short: you already did it, but could you try to explain the advantage of the old Lansky vise for me to understand?

And do you have an address where they sell these Lansky clamps, preferably in the Netherlands or Europe (and preferably without the rest of the Lansky system)?

[fvdk]

Hi Mark,

I am sure that the LAA adapter works great on most knives and if I would have been for the need of lower angles on my kitchen knives, I would certainly have bought one.

However, I have a lot of pocket knives and I needed a good solution for them. I have the Tormek adapter but for me it was not the solution I was looking for and needed too much tweaking. I hope that some of my ideas can be incorporated in a future version of the LAA as I love the system and it would be great if I could use it for all my knives.

As I mentioned in my previous post, the differences in the notches of the various clamps are very subtle and all will work but in such a small notch, tolerances are small and 2/10 of a mm can make the difference between lets say 80% or 100% clamping force.

Since this topic is about possible enhancements for the WE low angle adapter, I think it would be better to answer your specific questions in a private mail.

Frans

[wickededge]

Thank you for the very clear description of the issue. I’ll round up some of these clamps if I can and we’ll analyze how they work and see if we can’t make improvements to our LAA.

[fvdk]

That would be great. As one last addition, here is a page of the manual from the Loray sharpener. As far as I know, this was the original from which the Lansky was copied. It gives a very clear description of how the clamp should be used with different types of knives.

And a photo of the Loray clamp with the tapered notch