New Knife Database

[wickededge]

Bumping up the thread again to remind everyone to add your knives if you have a moment to spare.

-Clay

[Lukas Pop]

This database is great idea, but I think that details like recommended angle and finish are mostly the product of user preference, and its usefulness are questionable. I think comments from different people about processes an results of sharpening with different settings would be better.

[wickededge]

Thank you Lukas. I agree that the settings are subjective – it’s nearly impossible to come up with a single setting that all will agree is perfect for a given knife, especially since we all use them a little differently. It’s still instructive as a starting place for people to begin their own experience with a knife. The comments section is intended to provide a space where the user can discuss the reasons for choosing a given angle/finish for a knife. With my entries, for example, I try to detail my history with the knife and why I’ve come to adopt the settings I’m using. The more insightful the comments are from the submitter, the more useful the entry will be. As the database grows, patterns will emerge that will be meaningful. For example sorting the data by the ‘Steel’ column will allow a quick view into what settings the majority of people are using for a given steel, presumably based on experience using the knife. So if someone has just picked up a new knife and finds it in the database, they’ll have some pretty clear ideas as to what has been working well for others. Your comment does make me want to include a reply section so a dialog can begin for each knife as others jump on and discuss their experiences. I’ll mention it to our webmaster to see if it can be done. It would be very helpful.

This database is great idea, but I think that details like recommended angle and finish are mostly the product of user preference, and its usefulness are questionable. I think comments from different people about processes an results of sharpening with different settings would be better.

-Clay

[Leo James Mitchell]

I agree with Lukas that the anecdotal comments add great value to the database. User experience with the steel and edge angle is important to the usefulness of the data. Maybe it would be enough to increase the number of characters allowed in the slots where there is now a cap on the number allowed.
Of course there has to be a balance in the size of the anecdotal comments and the objective comments, otherwise long-winded guys like me might bury the value of the data in too many words. Hopefully, submitters will use discretion when making comments and restrict their comments to germane information.
See what I mean Clay! Long-winded guys! 😉 LOL!

Cheers
Leo

[BassLake Dan]

..some pretty clear ideas as to what has been working well for others. Your comment does make me want to include a reply section so a dialog can begin for each knife as others jump on and discuss their experiences. ..

Yes there is an issue about the database, an issue not so much with the database, actually, as with the knives themselves.

Here is an example of what I mean: I have thought about including my data on my CRK Sebenza, but when I look at my own notes and history with that knife I see that it is all too weird and complicated to put into the database. The knife went from convex, to 18 per side to microbevel, and none of that really worked because of hardness issues with CRK knives, so I am just scratching my head on what to do with the data, I would not want to mislead anyone that is scanning over that data.

Maybe we could start another column in the database (oh no! your poor webmaster !!) like a numeric 1..10 rating of the authors opinion of how successful a particular grind option is. Then I could make four entries for my Sebbie, all rated as to how great I think the result turned out, and the the top rating would be (for that knife) only a 6 or 7 as I don’t think you can ever really sharpen a CRK knife until they do something about their shops hardening policy. They take really *great* steels and then leave the loaf half-baked in the oven, so the result is soft squishy white bread 😆 Now my numeric rating, in contrast, to that knife, might be with my ZT / Elmax that is a solid 9.5, a razor blade in a folder, that’s for sure!

[BassLake Dan]

I agree with Lukas that the anecdotal comments add great value to the database. User experience with the steel and edge angle is important to the usefulness of the data. Maybe it would be enough to increase the number of characters allowed in the slots where there is now a cap on the number allowed.
Of course there has to be a balance in the size of the anecdotal comments and the objective comments, otherwise long-winded guys like me might bury the value of the data in too many words. Hopefully, submitters will use discretion when making comments and restrict their comments to germane information.
See what I mean Clay! Long-winded guys! 😉 LOL!

Cheers
Leo

I agree with the the above post exactly! Let’s keep the comment short and brief and to the point, but some amount of author experience comments *do* add much to frame the perspective and make sense out of the numeric data. I like reading them. They are very useful.

..BUT…I disagree strongly with Clays suggestion further down in this thread about adding a back and forth comment and reply area to the database. My fear would be that a database might degenerate into a “forum discussion area” and that would kill the usefulness of a database IMO.

[wickededge]

These are great thoughts guys. Nice point Dan about the conversation disintegrating in a forum discussion. If people want that level of discussion on specific knives, we can maybe do sub-forums somewhere. I see no problem with multiple entries for the same knife so people can see the range of what’s been tried. I also like the suggestion of a rating system though I wonder if it will get confusing. It would be great if we could cram all of the following into one record as in the attached PDF:

⇔ Manufacturer

⇔ Model

⇔ Blade Length

⇔ Thickness

⇔ Steel

⇔ Hardness

⇔ Recommended Angle

⇔ Recommended Finish

⇔ Depth

⇔ Alignment

⇔ Intent

Angle/Finish Tried Rating

Setting 1 4
Setting 2 3
Setting 3 7
Setting 4 6
Setting 6 8

Author

Author’s Comments

Attachments:

• KnifeDatabaseSample.pdf

-Clay

[Richard Green]

I agree that preferences for angle and sharpening sequence are going to vary. I think the problem with the database is that these items come from the person who submitted the entry, and this in effect gives that person the last word on the subject. Perhaps there should be an optional link to a forum discussion about the particular knife model. The creator can start it with his/her preferred angle and sharpening sequence, and others can freely comment. With a single link in the database, the entries would be nice and neat.

To me, the most useful part of the database are the manufacturer’s specifications and the WEPS vice depth and positioning information.

Speaking of specs I think there should be two columns for sharpening angle: one for the manufacturer’s published angle (if any) and one for the angle recommended by the person who created the entry.

[Tony Pettersen]

+1 on that

[wickededge]

I have a phone conversation with the webmaster scheduled for tomorrow based on all the feedback. We’ll continue to tweak it until it really becomes (or gets as close as possible) to the tool we all want it to be.

-Clay

[BassLake Dan]

Angle/Finish Tried Rating

Setting 1 4
Setting 2 3
Setting 3 7
Setting 4 6
Setting 6 8

Author

Author’s Comments

Yes, something along the line of your example above would work for me. But maybe others do not agree?

Just as an experiment I just tried to enter my Sml Sebbie data, and had to make four discrete entries, had to reenter the data 4 times (:unsure: ) so sure would be faster and more useful for me if it was just one entry with iterations in settings tried then one global comment about the entire effort to get the knife where you want it to be.

Also, I am unclear about the global edit button to the right of each enrty?? Does that mean that someone can come along and re-write my data over my old? Even with moderator approval of a re-write, I am unclear how or why that process is a benifit to the data? I am an experimenter, so like to see the record of all old previous attempts at a sharpening try, I like to see the path people are taking, not sure why we want to erase the bread crumbs that fell behind us as we travel forward on the yellow brick road…

[wickededge]

What you’re suggesting Dan makes a lot of sense. The database will be more meaningful with the additions. I think the balancing act is to record our breadcrumbs while still providing a very efficient guide for anyone looking for a starting place with a new knife.

-Clay

[wickededge]

Bump! The webmaster is adding the new features to the database, but even as we wait, we can still add new knives and build up the knowledge base.

-Clay

[BassLake Dan]

I just tried to enter a new knife (Mora Camp Knife#2) and had a few issues. It forced me to rate each of 4 setting or it would not accept the record to file, and it did not really have a place for the 4 settings, unless it intends me to just enter them in a comment area? For this particular knife I did not have a series of various setting. I do like the feature though, as mostly I *would* have a number of settings for a blade edge. Just need a place in the record of a file to innumerate them.

[wickededge]

Hi guys,
Our webmaster is working on this, so it’s not fully implemented. It was supposed to be done on Friday, apparently there is some delay….

-Clay

[Author]

Posts