Hrmm. this is unexpected.
I just looked at the stropped edge with a microscope and I dont think my strops are going all the way to the edge.
They seem to be polishing most of the bevel face but leaving a Microbevel of the stoned finish left over.
This is the blade coming off the 1000 grit stone
And this is it coming off the 3.5 leather strops
What I see is the darker portion is the polish effect of the strop and its cutting off just before the edge and then leaving a micro bevel of the old grit pattern.
[quote quote=“Geocyclist” post=18349]Thanks for making this simple test Spagery. I am surprised no one has does it already. Your results make sense.
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there has been research done right here on the forums! 
I can’t remember exactly where it is but Clay determined that edge leading produced the sharper edge…
Check this out for one reference
And here are some more pics comparing the two…
Also note that due to the natural result of stropping (slight convexing) it is recommended to lower your angle by 1-2 dps when going from your stones to the strops… this will yeild a sharper edge!
Very interesting! what were the last stones you used before going to the strops? Dis you measure angles w/ an angle cube?
Very interesting! what were the last stones you used before going to the strops? Dis you measure angles w/ an angle cube?[/quote]
I put the knife in the clamp and ran the 1000 grit stones over the blade then I went to the set of strops.
But I didnt look if the angle changed going from the stones to the strop paddles.
With my setup I have the basic arms and I use my iphone 5 as an angle cube.
I will put the knife back in the wicked edge and and see the difference between the stones and the strops.
I did check the angle of the stones at the very start of the process with my phone to set both sides to 20 degree.
Stand by.
Reading the left side with ihandy level I get 20.3 with the stones and 20.5 with the leather strop paddle.
If that reading is correct then there is a different issue going on… do you have any kind of micro scope?
Yea I cant make sense of that because I would of thought it was the other way around.
Ive got a little portable microscope called an eye clops that goes up to 400x I took those images of the edge at 100x Its kind of touchy to focus it at high magnification.
When I first saw it I thought that the strops put a micro bevel on the edge themselves. But you can tell that the bevel is polished by the strops and that its leaving behind the old grit right at the edge.
I wonder if your iphone is off… try moving the strops out a degree or two and see if it hits the very edge. I normally strop at minus 2 dps and it still hits the edge!
Hrmmm…
I wonder if this has something to do with the metal being pushed back to the spine side of the bevel instead of being drawn out over the edge. Making the back side of the bevel fatter then usual.
Iam gonna strop the other blade done with trailing edge strokes and see what happens.
I just stropped the trailing edge stroked knife with the leather strops and I cant detect any kind of microbeveling on this blade now like I just seen on the leading edge done blade.
Iam thinking that the back of the bevel is fatter and I will need to hold those strops at the top and maybe put more pressure on them to bend over the bevel now. Maybe even go up a degree, which is surprising.
Ahhh, if I had to guess what is happening, it is this.
When you did the edge leading passes then the stone was actually “tilting” over the edge of the knife (you were putting pressure at the top and the rods aren’t long enough to compensate if you don’t alter your hold). This created a bevel at the very edge that was actually steeper than what you intended it to be and is due to the slop in between the paddles/rods/base joints.
I just re-stropped the leading edge stroked knife up 1 degree and I started to see some improvement. So I went up another degree and did more stropping.
It is removing the microbevel but its taking alot of work with the strops.
Yea it could have something to do with the slop or maybe the pile up of the metal.
Someone else should try to recreate the micro bevel I got on the leading edge stroked knife.
Sharpen a blade from 100 grit up to 1000 with leading edge strokes at 20 degree, and then switch to the strops keeping the angle the same and see if it makes a microbevel after a bit of stropping.
If we can keep the slop to a minimum and still see the microbevel it means the cause is the metal piling up behind the bevel.
With the microscope the reflecting light has to be at just the right angle or else its hard to even see the microbevel, so this is kinda tricky.
Ive never stropped my kitchen knives before.
Usually we just stone them down to the finest stone and that is the edge we use. And we do it with leading edge strokes on the stones because it gives the blade a better slippery feel on the board.
Ive got the 1200 / 1600 paddles coming and my plan was to bring my knives up to their finish and not even use the strops on my own kitchen knives.
[quote quote=“Spagery” post=18372] …it means the cause is the metal piling up behind the bevel.
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not sure I understand what you are meaning…?
[quote quote=“razoredgeknives” post=18374][quote quote=“Spagery” post=18372] …it means the cause is the metal piling up behind the bevel.
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not sure I understand what you are meaning…?[/quote]
When we are doing the trailing edge strokes we are pulling the metal out into a wire at the tip of the edge.
But when you do the leading edge strokes the Opposite is happening. The metal that would normally form into the wire is drawn or cut back and it piles up behind the bevel making it fatter there.
As seen in this thread:
http://www.wickededgeusa.com/forum/10-advanced-techniques-and-sharpening-strategies/4658-leading-or-trailing-strokes?limit=6&limitstart=0&start=48
So I think when the strop is hitting the high point of the back of the bevel it is bending there instead of at the edge like it would do with trailing strokes.
After stropping the leading edge knife for awhile to try and remove the microbevel at +2 degree’s ive got it mostly removed by the strops.
And it seems like the cutting board bite has indeed returned.
When I first tested the stropped knife on the board it had an Invisible 1000 grit microbevel and it slid on the board just fine. But after looking at it with the microscope it revealed the microbevel to me and now I can see why the the knife slid on the board.
With all the trailing edge stropping I had to do to remove the microbevel from the edge ive thinned out the bevel and created a wire on the edge again.
Iam heading towards the conclusion that a Stone finish with leading edge strokes is better for Kitchen knives.
The 1000 grit microbevel still had a “true edge” even tho I put it to the strops.
Because no metal was drawn out over the edge to make a wire.
But after alot of stopping with a trailing edge technique it has drawn the wire out onto the edge.