Strops or stones ?

[CliffCurry]

I hope to do some testing soon with my auto body strips to see what grit works for me to  jump off the 1000 grit paddles to next…its somewhere in the sub 10 micron range, I think…I know once I get to lapping films its a quick n smooth progression down to sub 1um.

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Edwe, dulledge

[dulledge]

Mark76 wrote:

dulledge wrote:

Is 6 micron diamond lapping film better for removing 1000 grit diamond scratches than MFC and MFF?

No. Just faster .

In this test case faster is better. MFC and MFF makes smoother polish, but they are not as good at removing scratches as 6 um film in the same number of strokes. MFC and MFF should be used after 6 um film (if at all). I would never figured this out without Clay’s test pictures.

1 user thanked author for this post.

Organic

[Mark76]

I think these were a couple of great experiments with quite revealing outcomes. I may want to refer to them in the future and therefore I wrote two blog posts about them: Ceramic stones for the WEPS compared (again) and Efficiency of the Wicked Edge stones and diamond films.

All credits go to Clay, of course. I just summarized his results.

Molecule Polishing: my blog about sharpening with the Wicked Edge

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Josh, dulledge, Alan

[wickededge]

I got curious to see what the jump to the 6µ films looked like going straight from the 600# diamonds. So first, the 600# bevel and edge:

and then 20 strokes each side with a new set of 6µ films:

-Clay

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dulledge

[wickededge]

Here are a few other gratuitous shots:

This is out at the shoulder of the micro-bevel where some larger scratches from some new 600# stones were.

And here are a couple more shots of 600# scratches being erased by the diamond films:

I’m really impressed with how quickly the 6µ films work to clean up even the 600# scratches. My 600# stones are pretty well broken in, so I think I’ll give it a whirl with some new stones. I’m slowly preparing to redo the Grit Comparison Chart with new images and these studies are helping me refine my technique and create a plan. I’m thinking of showing the following: New Stone Bevel/New Stone Edge and Broken-In Stone Bevel/Broken-In Stone Edge. My hope is to help people see exactly what each stone does when it’s new and later once it’s broken in. Future studies will include exploring different transitions from stones to strops, diamonds to waterstones, coarse to very fine etc…

-Clay

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6 users thanked author for this post.

Organic, Alan, Josh, CliffCurry, dulledge, Frans

[wickededge]

BTW, those horizontal scratches are from when I clean the blade with a paper towel and rubbing alcohol. I do better when I’m using a lens cleaner instead. I didn’t think they’d show at such a coarse grit.

-Clay

[dulledge]

wickededge wrote:

I’m really impressed with how quickly the 6µ films work to clean up even the 600# scratches.

20 strokes and almost all of 600# is gone! WOW!

wickededge wrote:

My 600# stones are pretty well broken in, so I think I’ll give it a whirl with some new stones.

Also would be interesting to see side by side comparison of broken-in stone vs new stone.

[Mark76]

Wow! Strong stuff, that 6 micron diamond film!

Molecule Polishing: my blog about sharpening with the Wicked Edge

[Josh]

wickededge wrote:

BTW, those horizontal scratches are from when I clean the blade with a paper towel and rubbing alcohol. I do better when I’m using a lens cleaner instead. I didn’t think they’d show at such a coarse grit.

Clay,

That is a very very neat idea taking images of new and used stones at each grit for new users to get a visual of what’s going on!

Try getting a can of the green Brake Kleen from an auto store… it has acetone in it which cleans super well and evaporates really fast. I have been using it for years and I don’t think you would see any residue left even under high magnification.

Question: are the film prices on the site for an entire sheet or just 2 films (one for each paddle)? It doesn’t specify in the description…

[Anonymous]

Now ” This is Interesting to me ” ….  You want to know why?    Of course you do…. 🙂

While the close up photos are good, and I can see the edge ( very important to understand a point of reference ) And I can truly see the difference in the stones to film. IM also using film and finding it to be very impressive.

But “HERE” is the reason why I found this to be VERY INTERESTING… wait for it. 🙂     wait 🙂    OH the Drama !!!

This is what I got out of this…..

If going through all of the trouble to remove scratches, and viewing that under 2000 X is the motivation for perfection, then…. anything you cut with that knife,, anything.. will cause scratches… By your own admission… a paper towel and alcohol causes horizontal scratches…  So my point is.. if you want to display a scratch free knife which has been worked to perfection, you never want to use that knife to cut anything. Even using paper as a test of sharpness will cause scratches… I’m being a little irreverent , on purpose…only to show what some people might think as Over kill…. yes over kill…

I used that term, the very first day I was here, after reading a few posts… So even after three months, the theme of the forum is way too professional for the average New user…  This answers the question as to why there is so little participation here.

Ive been a little harsh , on purpose, but trying to point out an issue that may or may not be important to clay, and the other really nice guys ( to put up with all my tough love )… . I’m not sure if this is an eye opener, or a PITA…

A real revelation to me; is how a paper towel will cause scratches,, My first thought is what is the hardness of the steel? Next is, has the blade become soft because it has been worked too much? I can not imaging a paper towel causing scratches to a 63 Rock VG30 blade even a VG1

I understand pushing the limits of the process to perfection, but it has no practicality in the actual intent of a knife… that is, to cut something.

OK enough in your face from me,

Clay if this is a problem, or disruptive , please PM me…. and tell me so… I wont be angry. I’m just trying to give you some honest feedback on building the forum, not the personalities here, or the equipment, all of which are first class.

Bill aka ET

[dulledge]

Josh wrote:

Try getting a can of the green Brake Kleen from an auto store…

This one? CRC BRAKLEEN Chlorine-Free Brake Parts Cleaner – Low VOC

[Josh]

dulledge wrote:

RazorEdgeKnives wrote:

Try getting a can of the green Brake Kleen from an auto store…

This one? CRC BRAKLEEN Chlorine-Free Brake Parts Cleaner – Low VOC

Exactly… but it’s cheaper, around $5 from Walmart or the auto parts store =)

[dulledge]

Anonymous wrote:

A real revelation to me; is how a paper towel will cause scratches

Wrong. Paper towel with alcohol are needed to remove tiny leftovers crumbs of shaved blade steel. These crumbs are small particles of blade steel itself and they are as hard as blade steel. You need to remove these steel crumbs after each grit. If you don’t remove them, they will do 2 kinds of damage: 1) make scratches, 2) stick on next grit stone and they will scratch badly all knives you sharpen with that contaminated stone. Paper towel does not cause these bad scratches.

[Anonymous]

If the end game here is to have a perfect scratch free knife that can not be used to cut anything,  that’s great… it not my forum.

If the end game here in this forum is to build this forum into a community of people who have similar interests, revolving around the WE and knife sharpening  which also include the WE but not exclusive of the WE system and its products, then, the forum is way too narrow focused on scratches.

IM not saying that scratches are not a part of the whole process, but there needs to be more personal content… eg the video of Cliff’s process…his technique and the visual reference to the strokes and pressures he uses in his every day process….. While you can find dozens of these videos on You tube…people go to a forum for the personalities, the camaraderie, to find out what someone is doing in their life… which can revolve around the WE, but not exclusive of it. The WE forum is part of the whole WE system, people are not just buying into a sytem, they are buying into a community of nice people with similar interest in the hope of sharing common values, without fear of the ever so present ( I’m scared to ask a question of such professionals )

My contributions of the day…

[Anonymous]

dulledge wrote:

EvilTwin wrote:

A real revelation to me; is how a paper towel will cause scratches

Wrong. Paper towel with alcohol are needed to remove tiny leftovers crumbles of shaved blade steel. These crumbles are small particles of blade steel itself and they are as hard as blade steel. You need to remove them after each grit. If you don’t remove them, they will do 2 kinds of damage: 1) make scratches, 2) stick on next grit stone and they will scratch badly all knives you sharpen with that contaminated stone. Paper towel does not cause these bad scratches.

Wrong, Wrong.. did you say WRONG????

OH how kind and insensitive…  My point ( which you obviously missed )was that using anything to wipe off the blade causes scratches, so why try to (remove all scratches, down to the sub micron, go through all that trouble and time ) when the last thing you do is wipe off the knife????

THAT WAS MY POINT”

Wrong indeed

[Author]

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