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Single bevel knife .. how to sharpen it?

This topic contains 7 replies, has 3 voices, and was last updated by  airscapes 03/08/2019 at 2:14 pm.

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  • #49648

    airscapes
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    So my neighbor dropped off 2 more knives while I was out.. One is serrated so nothing I can do with that.. and the other is I guess a boning knife?  It has what I believe you refer to as a chisel grind?  Bevel on one side and flat on the other.  I have read the few post made some years ago on how to sharpen this and still not clear.  With how narrow this is, not even sure it will work in the standard vice without a low angle adapter..  Any advice is much appreciated.

     

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    #49651

    MarcH
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    It appears it’s an antique filet knife.  Like something I found in my grandmothers kitchen drawer 50 years ago.  I would take any edge profile you see with a grain of salt.  There’s no telling what that oldie’s been through.  I’m guessing it is stainless steel, otherwise the blade would probably be black with patina.

    I’d profile it at (50/50) even bevel at 20º per side.  That’s a good starting place for a general purpose cutting edge and as wide as I’d generally use in the kitchen.  This way, after you learn how it cuts and holds an edge you can always go more acute.  I don’t like to start acute then try to go wider.  It wastes too much steel in that order.  I sharpen filet/boning knives for a friend at 20º with good reports.

    Marc
    (MarcH's Rack-It)

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    #49652

    airscapes
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    So you would abandon the original single sided  bevel?

    A search on the bay turns up a set that from photos still has the single bevel so assuming that was factory..

    https://www.ebay.com/itm/SET-JA-BORNSCHAFT-KITCHEN-KNIVES-FILET-PARING-BREAD-SERRATED-PARE-13-CHEF-WOOD/372601531890?hash=item56c0c82df2:g:yVAAAOSwuINbUKlT

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    #49655

    MarcH
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    Ah, you were holding back.  The single grind is only evident in the first photos after seeing the better, closer up photos in your second post, and knowing where to look for it.  I made a assumption from a glance.  I didn’t know you knew the brand and had other pictures of similar knives.

    That being said I stick by my story…it is an old knife my grandmother would have used.  It looks like a set of non-forged stainless steel knives.  The primary grind is one sided.  I would still sharpen the bevel at (50/50) 20 dps, both for ease of sharpening and repeat-ability.

    If you’re looking to restore the knives, not just sharpen them, then I’d consider matching the grind.  I don’t see the value in that amount of work seeing the set on eBay for $14.

    I had a similarly ground carving knife I took from my grandmother after her passing.  It was a great tough old high vanadium steel knife that sharpened well and held it’s edge.

    Marc
    (MarcH's Rack-It)

    #49656

    airscapes
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    Ok great, will make it a lot simpler and I do realize this is just an old inexpensive knife.

    I assume you would not profile to the point of removing the old bevel completely, just until the bevel is even in width on both sides at the new angle?

    • This reply was modified 2 weeks, 4 days ago by  airscapes.
    #49658

    MarcH
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    Exactly, I would just ignore the primary grind and sharpen it as if it was not there.  Like any other knife.

    Marc
    (MarcH's Rack-It)

    #49660

    tcmeyer
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    I was going to state that the owner should be queried before abandoning the chisel grind, but someone’s already done that.  Now it would be a major reprofiling to return to a true chisel.  I agree with Marc – go with a 50/50 profile.

    Chisel grinds produce a very acute included angle, and this needs to be considered when choosing an angle.  A 20 degree chisel grind is inherently weak for routine kitchen cutting.  The Japanese do it for a reason, but they already have a culture of very acute angles on their edges and teach strict use and maintenance practices.  Some kitchen chores benefit from a chisel grind, but then handedness can be an issue.  I’m a lefty, so my chisel grind kitchen knife is a problem for other guests in my kitchen.  The photos seem to me to show right-handed chisel grinds.

    I got a cheap folder in the mail once, as a subscription gift from the state natural resources magazine and I use it in my woodshop for the worst applications.   It’s a POS, with a chisel edge on a half-serrated edge.  Why chisel grind?  The serration grind was much easier as single-sided, so they continued the grind process to the tip, resulting in the chisel grind on the straight edge.  From this, we can infer that chisel grinds are sometimes  used for expedience (cost).

    The main problem with chisel grinds is that the lower-included-angle knives are subject to serious edge damage, which requires that a lot of steel be removed to erase the damage.  They seem to take forever to sharpen by hand – on a guided rig or on standard sharpening stones.

    #49662

    airscapes
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    Thanks Tom!  I would indeed ask the owner if I thought he cared.. but he said.. Hey look what I found in the bottom of the drawer.. it was this one and a serrated knife like you get at OutBack only cheaper..   He is just doing what I asked and giving me anything and everything to practice on..  And it’s free for him!

    You may have seen the before and after image of one of his  butter .. I mean steak knives in another post.  I actually think this old filet knife is the sharpest knife he has given me..   He said his wife asked him .. “Does he have to make them so sharp?”   I hear she is accident pron so maybe he has an ulterior  motive in me sharpening his knives  🙂  I give them back in amazon bubble envelope  sheaths.   I knew I would find a use for those new plastic envelopes..

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