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Setting the knife (ET's 'O' ring method)…

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  • #31201
    Anonymous
    Inactive
    • Topics: 14
    • Replies: 427

    Recently I’ve been playing with a new technique for dealing with blade deflection. It only works with a downward stroke. I hold both stones against the blade, one just in front of the other and push them forward and down. It’s important to hold the stones low down on the handles to keep your hands safe. I make one stroke that way and then switch the stones so the other is in front. I went slowly at first to get the motion down and now I can go at a really nice pace. It’s important to continue alternating which stone is in front so that you don’t make a huge burr on one side.

    Ill throw this out there, because that’s what I do, convolute a discussion.. LOL… I know first hand that there is a big difference in work output when it come to left side brain and  left arm and right arm output.  AS a former competitive shooter we all have a strong side and a weak side.. we also have a dominant eye. I think left handed people will use more force with their right hand, wrist, arm etc.  With out the use of a Tinious Olsen force gauge it would be hard to see what the difference between left hand pressure and right hand pressure actually is..

    I’m still happy having a sharp knife to cut my tomato. I also still think, the quest for precision is admirable, but with all the variables of a WEPS its like trying to thread a needle with a piece of rope.  IM adding some levity, and its not to be confused with disrespect. The WEPS is the finest piece of hand sharpening equipment for the single home user. There are 3000 and 4000 dollar professional machines for production sharpening .  I could not find anything that would take my sharpening to the heights that I’ve achieved over the last two months until I bought the WEPS.

    Trying to achieve precision  success is  like taking a Stock Corvette and trying to make it perform like  a formula 1 race car or a NASCAR  or Winston cup Car.  And like those 300,000 dollar race cars, it takes the experience of the driver to win a race.  Same with  a knife, or a gun , or a camera, its not the gun, its the gunner. Not the camera, but the Photog. Also, almost any one here has much more experience than I do. So my input to anything about sharpening a knife is from a purely amateur point of view.

    #31220
    Mark76
    Participant
    • Topics: 179
    • Replies: 2760

    Recently I’ve been playing with a new technique for dealing with blade deflection. It only works with a downward stroke. I hold both stones against the blade, one just in front of the other and push them forward and down. It’s important to hold the stones low down on the handles to keep your hands safe. I make one stroke that way and then switch the stones so the other is in front. I went slowly at first to get the motion down and now I can go at a really nice pace. It’s important to continue alternating which stone is in front so that you don’t make a huge burr on one side.

    That sounds like a good idea, Clay. I’m going to try it. But why does it work only with a downward stroke? Because you use less pressure then?

    Molecule Polishing: my blog about sharpening with the Wicked Edge

    #31221
    Mark76
    Participant
    • Topics: 179
    • Replies: 2760

    I’m still playing with the idea of making an app that tells you the “ideal” position of the knife in the clamp. If we’re all satisfied with the approximate method that doesn’t take the planes into account (like ET’s O ring method) it should not be that difficult (once I’ve mastered the programming side ).

    But the problem is, zero angle variation along a curved blade is impossible, except in special cases where it is possible to clamp the blade so the entire edge coincides with the straight line or the circle. This is the special case:

    In all other cases, the question is: what do you want to optimize? Do you want the sharpening angle at the tip to be the same as the angle at the straight portion of the edge? Or do you want the sharpening angle halfway curve towards the tip to be the same? Or do you want to minimize something else?

    I quote Redhead’s picture because it also shows you have various options.

    circles

    Molecule Polishing: my blog about sharpening with the Wicked Edge

    #31224
    CliffCurry
    Participant
    • Topics: 42
    • Replies: 461

    Ok so no calc or trig from this kid…but I do have a badly made youtube video with shoddy cardboard props…Im attempting the video making learning curve so please go easy.

    With the Delica I just did there was no room for error.  I know Josh and others deal with expensive knives everyday but this was my own and one of the nicest I own so failure was not an option, especially at 10dps!
    Heres the bevel half way to rough reprofile and you can see the sweep served me well as I made sure the paddle arc matched the blade curve precisely and the results tell me Ill be ok.Even-bevel-reprofile

    I like precise and I also like practical.  I hope the video added something to the conversation.  I know for me it gave me a to-do on my mod list…any guesses? 

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    #31233
    Victor
    Participant
    • Topics: 1
    • Replies: 80

    Thank you for your coherent Vid and your cardboard props is great!

    Similarity, I use marked paddle side  for initial line up, then, flip to grit side for witness check, very simple and practical.

     

    2 users thanked author for this post.
    #31238
    Mark76
    Participant
    • Topics: 179
    • Replies: 2760

    Welcome, Victor. Thanks for your contribution. If you want to share more, please feel free!

    Molecule Polishing: my blog about sharpening with the Wicked Edge

    #31280
    wickededge
    Keymaster
    • Topics: 122
    • Replies: 2933

    Recently I’ve been playing with a new technique for dealing with blade deflection. It only works with a downward stroke. I hold both stones against the blade, one just in front of the other and push them forward and down. It’s important to hold the stones low down on the handles to keep your hands safe. I make one stroke that way and then switch the stones so the other is in front. I went slowly at first to get the motion down and now I can go at a really nice pace. It’s important to continue alternating which stone is in front so that you don’t make a huge burr on one side.

    That sounds like a good idea, Clay. I’m going to try it. But why does it work only with a downward stroke? Because you use less pressure then?

    It only works with a downward stroke because your hands are moving away from each other in that direction whereas they’re moving toward each other in an upstroke and they bump into each other.

    -Clay

    #31312
    Anonymous
    Inactive
    • Topics: 14
    • Replies: 427

    The marks on the paddle are a great idea…. the less ” extra stuff ” in the set up process, is a plus. The only thing I see as a deterrent to this idea is,

    The paddle floats, its not locked into a start position. Normal floating could effect the hash mark reference.  The O ring is moveable but requires much more pressure to move it to a new place. The O ring is locked into a set position on the rod . It can stay on the rod ( just slid down  to the bottom of the rod ) . If your rods are slippery, like mine, I would not trust my ability to hold the paddle in a set position. It also requires that you focus on keeping the paddle from moving even slightly. The O ring allows you to focus on the set up, not on the position of the paddle, or potential movement on the rod.

    #31313
    Anonymous
    Inactive
    • Topics: 14
    • Replies: 427

    My thoughts on blade deflection are along the lines of a universal brace, that can be clamped into the jaws. The only problem with this is the actual internal brace angle for various blades by design be nice to have , and a 6 inch brace, considering the only blade brace now is the  0.750 in. vice jaw. which works well for 3 inch blades. A brace would also allow the knife to be higher in the vice and able to produce greater acute angles. The big problem with a brace is stone stoke clearance. So in constructing a formula requires a design that will work with knives of different design, a brace rigid enough by material and design, and the ability to clear the stone stroke… The is how a concept idea starts. we have already defined a problem : blade deflection.

    This is just an idea, from a very novice and amateur member., At GM we call this process, an F.M.E.A. failure modes effect analysis.

    Bill aka ET

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