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Grit angle change

This topic contains 48 replies, has 5 voices, and was last updated by  NorCalQ 01/15/2019 at 1:49 pm.

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  • #48258

    MarcH
    Moderator
    • Topics: 58
    • Replies: 1855

    Answer  a couple last questions. Do you see a consistency between every other stone? The only time you see this is going from 800 to 1000? Does it also happen 800 to 1000 if you swap the stones end for end and side for side?

    Marc
    (MarcH's Rack-It)

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    #48270

    Drew
    Participant
    • Topics: 11
    • Replies: 72

    I was seeing this from stone to stone. The 50-80 was too course to tell, and each grit was easy enough to correct for with enough scrubbing. The 800-1k was just where it got too difficult to correct for, and it dawned on me what I was seeing, and how serious a problem it was.

     

    That is an excellent test. I’m going to digest for a bit, hydrate, then go try it out. Oooo…. If I have energy, I’ll flip same side, like you suggested, then switch sides completely, then flip again to see what happens.

    #48271

    MarcH
    Moderator
    • Topics: 58
    • Replies: 1855

    I’ve read all your posts in this thread, a couple of times and I can’t get a handle on this issue because I don’t read if you experience the same situation  with the other stones as you do with the 800 grit going to the 1000 grit situation.  Do you see the same situation that you encounter between the 800 and the 1000 grit with the other stones up to when you reach the 800 grit?

    Drew if the marker is removed but still left on the bottom of the bevel on the left knife side, and left on the top of the bevel on the right knife side, with the 100/200 grit, 400/600 grit and the 800 grit, but then the remaining marker is finally removed clean only when using the 1000 grit, the problem is with the 1000 grit.  The 1000 grit would be inconsistent with the results of the other stones.

    But, if the marker is cleanly removed across the entire bevel, shoulder to edge, on both sides of the knife, with the 100/200 grit, 400/600 grit and then again with 1000 grit, but the marker is only left on the bottom of the bevel on the left knife side, and left on the top of the bevel on the right knife side, only when you use the 800 grit,  then the problem is with the 800 grit.  Then 800 grit is inconsistent with the rest of the grits.

    I also want to say a scrubbing stroke will remove the marker while applying a scratch pattern across the entire bevel, apex to shoulder, better than if you are just are doing a single direction stroke, (e.g., an edge leading or an edge trailing stroke).  It does take longer with the single direction strokes and often moving around your finger placement on the stone, while doing the single direction strokes, before you’ll cover the bevel completely with the scratch pattern and remove all the marker from the bevel.  This effect is also more evident with the older style paddles, like yours, and the older style and slightly thinner angle guide rods.  There is a little wider tolerance or more wiggle room on the older model stones and guide rods.

    Marc
    (MarcH's Rack-It)

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    #48272

    Drew
    Participant
    • Topics: 11
    • Replies: 72

    I literally can’t understand what I’m reading, anymore. I got sucked into this in the morning, and haven’t eaten a proper meal yet.

    I’ll reread after rest. I dig part of what you said. Yes, 100-200, slight difference in angle. Scrub full flat, 200-400, slight difference in contact at 15°. Easy to correct for with scrubbing. 15 min to flatten bevel per grit.

     

    Ok, here’s same paddles, same side, just flipped over.

     

    B side 800, b side 1k.

     

    I’ll catch you all tomorrow. Thank you, again.

    Attachments:
    #48278

    tcmeyer
    Participant
    • Topics: 33
    • Replies: 1835

    Drew:  Sorry, but I have a bad case of ADD and don’t have the patience to real all the prior posts, especially at 4:45 AM. .  I’ll suggest that you measure the angles on both sides of that handle – both the 800 and 1000 grit sides.  I used my stones for almost two years before I finally figured out that one of the plates wasn’t seated properly in its pocket.  I don’t know if that’s your problem, but it’s worth looking at.  Here’s a photo showing that I could insert a scalpel between the plate and the handle rim.  The fix was five minutes of cutting the end of the pocket off with a hacksaw blade.

    WE 1000 grit platen B4

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    #48279

    Drew
    Participant
    • Topics: 11
    • Replies: 72

    Tc, I just checked, and the 800-1k stones on both paddles are seated. It looks like the assembler put the stones in the pocket, then pushed each stone to one end of the pocket or the other, stone-end flush with pocket-edge, but the stones are definitely in there.

     

    How would I check the angle of each stone? Put the paddles in the 90 of a straight-edge/square, zero cube on straight-edge, then cube the paddle?

    I’ll go see if I can’t track down a square.

    #48280

    MarcH
    Moderator
    • Topics: 58
    • Replies: 1855

    Drew when you track down the square, you can use the square to measure the distance to the knife edge form side to side, with the square sitting flat on the base and slid flat up against the vice side, to see if the knife is leaning to one side.

    You probably think my detailed questions in my posts above are a P.I.A. to read and figure out what I’m asking you.  If you’d just take the time and effort to indulge me, the answers will help us diagnose your issue.  You’ve eliminated a miss-seated mounted stone.  Let’s look for another issue.

    Marc
    (MarcH's Rack-It)

    #48281

    Drew
    Participant
    • Topics: 11
    • Replies: 72

    I knew you’d jump on that. Yes, as soon as I track down the square, I’ll test for straight or list.

     

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    #48282

    Drew
    Participant
    • Topics: 11
    • Replies: 72

    We’ve got everything packed in totes in storage. I’m going up to check the manifest.

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    #48283

    Drew
    Participant
    • Topics: 11
    • Replies: 72

    Marc, I just cubed the flat of the blade. It shows ~.55° off center.

    Tell me your thoughts on this.

    #48284

    Drew
    Participant
    • Topics: 11
    • Replies: 72

    Found a small 90°.

     

    Base bottom, degree bar, and vise bottom as contact points. Zeroed cube on base and vertical flat of square. Set paddle to measure vertical. Right paddle first, then left. Bottom first, then top. 800 and 1k sides against square. Holding paddles against the square-flat with pressure on bottom.

    It’s a poorly controlled experiment, but best I have at the moment.

     

    Right paddle:

    Attachments:
    #48289

    Drew
    Participant
    • Topics: 11
    • Replies: 72

    Left paddle:

    Attachments:
    #48294

    Drew
    Participant
    • Topics: 11
    • Replies: 72

    I know that testing 50/80 variance is like testing a hand grenade for accuracy, but, starting from the lowest to highest:

    50/80, paddle 1

    Attachments:
    #48299

    Drew
    Participant
    • Topics: 11
    • Replies: 72

    50/80 paddle 2

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    #48304

    Drew
    Participant
    • Topics: 11
    • Replies: 72

    100/200, paddle 1

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