Ball Joint Arms rod threads

[Phil Pasteur]

Hey Guys,
I bought some stainless steel precision ground rod stock to try my hand at making some longer rods for use with the ball joints (larger rods). I have them cut to 12″ so that I can try actually sharpening that 3″ cleaver the I posted photos of, using the one of the prototype low angle extensions. I need to thread the ends so that they can screw into the ball joints.

I think the threads are 1/4″ NF (28), but the current rods don’t want to thread into a die of that size completely. Nor does a tap thread all of the way through the lock nut. It is close. The diameter should be OK as the rods are right at .25″ measured in multiple places with a dial caliper. Now I know that machined threads are not exactly like the ones cut with a die, but I hate to butcher up these fairly expensive rods by cutting the wrong threads.

Does anyone know for sure the correct thread size and pitch as used on the ball joint arms?
If so, please let me know.

THX

Phil

[wickededge]

PS.
Clay, did you get my email with the thread question?

I did, though can’t seem to locate it now. If I remember correctly, you’re asking what the threading is on the guide rods that go into the ball joint. You’re correct that they are 1/4-28 threads. I haven’t had much luck hand threading any rods either.

-Clay

[Mikedoh]

I don’t know, but maybe this will help. Was posted on an airgun forum I follow.

http://www.boltdepot.com/fastener-information/Printable-Tools/Printable-Fastener-Tools.pdf

[Phil Pasteur]

Great resource… but not a definitive answer.
As I said, I hate to screw these up… I just got enough stock for two pieces…
I guess Clay saw this ??

[Phil Pasteur]

Thanks for that…

Yes that was the question..
Not encouraging if you have not had any luck doing this..
Maybe I need to find a machine shop..

Thanks!

PS.
Clay, did you get my email with the thread question?

I did, though can’t seem to locate it now. If I remember correctly, you’re asking what the threading is on the guide rods that go into the ball joint. You’re correct that they are 1/4-28 threads. I haven’t had much luck hand threading any rods either.[/quote]

[wickededge]

Great resource… but not a definitive answer.
As I said, I hate to screw these up… I just got enough stock for two pieces…
I guess Clay saw this ??

Hey Phil,

I replied in the other thread. You’re right that 1/4-28 is the thread to use. I haven’t had much luck getting the steel rods through the die either. It works just fine with our old fiber reinforced plastic rods, they’re soft enough, but the steel is another story.

-Clay

[wickededge]

Thanks for that…

Yes that was the question..
Not encouraging if you have not had any luck doing this..
Maybe I need to find a machine shop..

Thanks!

I don’t have a lathe here at the shop and I think that’s what I’d need to do it properly, there is simply too much material to remove. Now that I’m thinking about it, I was able to thread rods once by putting them in the drill press and spinning them while the die was clamped to the table, but I don’t recall the steel and how wear resistant it was.

-Clay

[Phil Pasteur]

I have a small bench drill press and a vise for it, maybe I will give that a try…
I thought about one of those split dies. Maybe open it up a bit at first then tighten it up a bit until the right minor diameter is achieved. The old cut and try trick..
🙂

[wickededge]

I have a small bench drill press and a vise for it, maybe I will give that a try…
I thought about one of those split dies. Maybe open it up a bit at first then tighten it up a bit until the right minor diameter is achieved. The old cut and try trick..
🙂

That’s a good idea. If you go with a split die, I’d be very curious to hear how it turns out.

-Clay

[Phil Pasteur]

Yeah I saw the answer ..after I wrote here.. and thanks.
This stuff is 406 L IIRC… I tapered the end pretty well. The die just will not bite enough to get going.
Tried my drill press, but the chuck to base distance is not enough.
Maybe will try with one of those split adjustable dies. Maybe try a machine shop that might do little jobs for a decent price. Maybe give up and wait for you to have some made properly..

Thanks for the answer!

Phil

[cbwx34]

I’m going to move those posts into this thread… so they’ll be easy to find later if needed.

🙂

[Phil Pasteur]

Thanks for the move Curtis!!

Phil

[Colby Webre]

Anyone tried using zinc rods? A bit more malleable.

[Phil Pasteur]

Well I finally got those new 416 Stainless Steel precision ground rods threaded.

BTW, they claim it to be shipped in the annealed state, about Brinell 220 which translates to a Rockwell C number of only around 21. Precision ground Diameter tolerance is ±0.0005″. Anyway. pretty soft stuff…

Anyway
it is done!
:woohoo:

A serious pain, but I got there.
I ordered a “split” adjustable 1/4″ NF (28) die. I opened it all of the way up and even stretched it a bit. I then filed a more generous bevel on the ends of the rods. With 200 pounds pressing on the die, I finally got it to bite. I guess persistence pays off sometimes. Rods threaded into the ball joints and lock nut just fine.

Now to get some time to try them out…
One thing I can say from playing just a bit. Technique in stone movement will need to be more deliberate and the tips of the rods pulled to the side with deliberation. The ends of those 12″ long suckers seem to want to get tangled up with each other… :ohmy: This will slow me down.. at least until I get the hang of it.
🙂

I can see why Clay picked the length that he did for “normal” sharpening jobs with the standard vise.

[Mark76]

The ends of those 12″ long suckers seem to want to get tangled up with each other… :ohmy: This will slow me down.. at least until I get the hang of it.
🙂

I can see why Clay picked the length that he did for “normal” sharpening jobs with the standard vise.

That’s a good point. Never realized that. It happened more often when I was less experienced, but the rods still get tangled up once in a while, particularly when I’m hasty.

I guess it’s a bit like a pike when rowing. “Pike” is a literal translation from Dutch and I don’t know whether it is correct, but it’s a term for when your oar gets stuck in the water (and then immediately slows down the entire boat) because of a wrong movement.

Molecule Polishing: my blog about sharpening with the Wicked Edge

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